Saints vs. East Fife 08/08/06

[Radford 72]

Hope Dev doesn't mind me starting this now!

I would start Jacko on Tuesday night, he'll be eager to impress and won't give the East Fife defenders a moment's rest. Also the perfect opportunity to have a look at Derek Young.

I'd go...

Halliwell

Rutkewicz - McManus - James

Lawrie - Hardie - Mensing - Young - Stanic

Scotland - Jackson

Subbies: Cuthbert, Stevo, Peaso, Savo, Sheerin.

Will be strange having all the fans in one stand for a competitive game, hopefully it won't become a regular thing, that would be too depressing.

Is Craig Johnston still with East Fife?

[MUZZ]

not sure if i'll go. is it wort forking out another ten spot to watch that shite after todays pish. season ticket should include these games :evil:

[SaintSam1884]

I'm going. I predicted 6-0 I think and want to see loads and loads of goals.

If we draw 0-0 with them, I might cry.

[Saint Jonny]

craig johnston is on loan at kinnoull juniors.

[Dev]

Hope Dev doesn't mind me starting this now!

You trying to steal my thunder? :evil: :evil: :wink:

I would start Jacko on Tuesday night, he'll be eager to impress and won't give the East Fife defenders a moment's rest. Also the perfect opportunity to have a look at Derek Young.

Agreed. Jacko has a good history of scoring against lower league opposition now so he should definitely get his chance. I'd love a repeat of his goal at Inverurie, twas a peach!

I'd agree with your team selection although I'm tempted to suggest playing Peaso instead of Scotland after Jason's lacklustre display today and Peaso's good showing as a substitute.

[t]

Is this the first competive game that only the main stand has been opened?

Bad precedent.

[Broon]

Lets get this thread back to the top. I probably wasn't going to go to this game but seeing as I didn't see a Saints goal on Saturday and won't be at the Queen's match I will drag myself up to perth for this one!

I would like to see Peaso and Scotland start in attack with Young and Hardie and Sheerin in the middle. No need for a defensive midfielder for this one
8)

[Watty]

Is this the first competive game that only the main stand has been opened?

Bad precedent.

Will be the same story for Raith Rovers gamey next week. :wink:

[Rodgers]

Am going :D , after missing saturdays game :( because i had a game of my own, this will be my first for the season :D

[Saint Hayley]

I shall be heading doon as per usual. Should be a win in the bag for us.

MON THE BLUES

[101 Saint]

How much will OC vary the team from his preferred starting XI given the draw on Saturday? Personally, I think he ought to field the best eleven he has and give them (more) time together in a competitive scenario.

His midfield line-up intrigues me. In a three man midfield; Mensing and Sheridan are competing against each other for the defensive role, Young and Hardie will do likewise for the link-up role and Sheerin will start come what may.

Given OCs reluctance to deviate from 3-5-2, hence no wingers, if Young extends his stay, perhaps the summer signings cease?

On a different note, perhaps Scrabble and Dobbie should play some part in the 90 minutes in order to remain in the shop window.

[Saint Paul]

I am looking forward to this game. It is the first this season for me as I was working at the Perth Show on Saturday. :cry:

Also, the work has booked hospitallity this year, and we are having our first use of it tonight ! :***:

I am really looking forward to seeing how Derek Young plays. I think he could give us something a bit different in midfield. I also agree with Radford that I would like to see Jackson start as I think he deserves a chance to show that he could push the other strikers for a place.

[Ronaldo]

This is a very important game.
Cup runs are essential for clubs our size when in a lower division. It's one of the few ways you can achieve more than the expected or budgeted revenue for the season other than say cash received for a player.

[blueheaven]

I wouldn't be starting Jackson for this one - I think it's more important to get our recognised strikers playing well than to give youngsters a run out, which for me means starting with Scotland and Peaso. I do think Sheridan might be rested for this one though, so I think the team might be something along the lines of...

_______________Halliwell

____Rutkiewicz__McManus__James

Lawrie__Young__Mensing__Sheerin__Stanic

__________Scotland__MacDonald

Subs: Cuthbert, Anderson, Hardie, Stevenson, Milne

Am I right in thinking we don't have a single injury at the moment? If so, it must be the first time in about 10 years!? :shock: :)

[saint_markperth]

id be going for

_______________Halliwell

____Rutkiewicz__McManus__James

Lawrie__Young__Mensing__Sheerin__Stanic

__________Jackson__Coyle

Surely the OC has to get a goal for us at some point, id put my money on it being tonight

[Broon]

2 Posts in a row without Hardie, arguably our best midfielder, in the side. Just shows what one addition to the squad in the right position would make. Lets hope Young is what we are after :)

[blueheaven]

2 Posts in a row without Hardie, arguably our best midfielder, in the side. Just shows what one addition to the squad in the right position would make. Lets hope Young is what we are after :)

That said, having just read Young's comments in the PA about not being fully fit yet and only expecting to get a half, I'd now change my team to put Hardie in the starting line-up! :P

[Radford 72]

I wouldn't be starting Jackson for this one - I think it's more important to get our recognised strikers playing well than to give youngsters a run out...
He's a first team squad player so if tonight isn't a chance to play him, when is?

He's proved with Cowdenbeath and Forfar he can play against teams of this level so let him have a chance with us.

People questioned Clark when he first started playing Parker and he took his chance amazingly well.

[1884]

He's a first team squad player so if tonight isn't a chance to play him, when is?

He's proved with Cowdenbeath and Forfar he can play against teams of this level so let him have a chance with us.

I agree, Radford. Some of his finishing in the pre-season games was immense. 8)

[blueheaven]

I wouldn't be starting Jackson for this one - I think it's more important to get our recognised strikers playing well than to give youngsters a run out...
He's a first team squad player so if tonight isn't a chance to play him, when is?

I think the time to play him is when the players who are ahead of him in the queue, fair and square, are either injured, suspended or in poor form. Why should Jackson skip ahead of the likes of Scotland, Milne & Peaso for a place in the team? The important thing for Saints tonight is actually winning the game, not giving chances to youngsters. If Jackson's really good enough, then he'll be able to wait for his chance and then keep his place in the team when it comes along - not queue-jump for no reason.

[Jimmy Wallace]

I think the time to play him is when the players who are ahead of him in the queue, fair and square, are either injured, suspended or in poor form. Why should Jackson skip ahead of the likes of Scotland, Milne & Peaso for a place in the team? The important thing for Saints tonight is actually winning the game, not giving chances to youngsters. If Jackson's really good enough, then he'll be able to wait for his chance and then keep his place in the team when it comes along - not queue-jump for no reason.

Arguably the form of Scotland and Milne isn't good enough. They certainly weren't good enough on Saturday, so I don't think you could say a starting position for Jackson would be queue jumping for no reason.

[blueheaven]

Arguably the form of Scotland and Milne isn't good enough. They certainly weren't good enough on Saturday, so I don't think you could say a starting position for Jackson would be queue jumping for no reason.

That's true, but there's only been one game. I just don't think anyone can realistically say at the moment that Jackson - a guy who's never scored a first team goal for us and is largely untried & untested - is ahead of Scotland or Peaso for a place in the team just now.

[Jimmy Wallace]

That's true, but there's only been one game. I just don't think anyone can realistically say at the moment that Jackson - a guy who's never scored a first team goal for us and is largely untried & untested - is ahead of Scotland or Peaso for a place in the team just now.

We could always play him at the back, he's bound to be better than Anderson :wink:

I'd like to see Jackson get a decent run out, not just 10 minutes at the end. He's an exciting prospect who has done well against teams a division down and if he proves he can cut it, it's more good competition for our other strikers. I take your point that we've only had one game, but we really lacked a cutting edge on Saturday, and who knows Jacko could be the one to help provide it, hell, Owen is even quoted as suggesting he might play Derek Young up front tonight. I think we should get Jackson on the pitch for a good half hour at least to see what he can do.

[Radford 72]

I would say Jackson was our most impressive forward in the pre-season. He had a niggling injury, hence his non-inclusion at Stirling and withdrawl at half-time in the Cowdenbeath game otherwise I seriously reckon he could've been pushing for a start.

Like 1884 says, his finishing in pre-season was superb and there's no doubt in my mind he deserves a chance.

[wee john]

I cannot understand people saying Jason should be dropped, off form, etc.
If you do not know his style of play now you never will.
He will never change, he wants the ball at his feet, he will never run all over the park. That is his style.
He is a class act in this league, arguably the best player in it, he is a constant threat and gaurantees us at least 15 goals a season and will create as many.
Without him we would be in a worse position.

[wee john]

Aslong as Coyle does not put himself in before Jacko.

[Broon]

He is a class act in this league, arguably the best player in it, he is a constant threat and gaurantees us at least 15 goals a season and will create as many.
Without him we would be in a worse position.

Spot on. How can a player be off form after one game?

[Radford 72]

I cannot understand people saying Jason should be dropped, off form, etc.
If you do not know his style of play now you never will.
He will never change, he wants the ball at his feet, he will never run all over the park. That is his style.
He is a class act in this league, arguably the best player in it, he is a constant threat and gaurantees us at least 15 goals a season and will create as many.
Without him we would be in a worse position.
I agree totally.

I'd much rather he was in the opponent's half all the time than back defending where he can do no damage.

Russell Latapy was always labelled lazy as well and he was a class act too.

Jason would run for 90 minutes if he had the ball, how is that lazy?

[Broon]

Jason would run for 90 minutes if he had the ball, how is that lazy?

So much sense on the forum in just a few minutes :D

I struggle to see why people call him lazy, the guy makes more runs with the ball than anyone on the park. If Jason ran after every single ball like Milne does, he would be too knackered to do what he does best.

[Jimmy Wallace]

I agree too, but I'm not sure if anyone actually said Scotland was lazy and had a loss of form. He did lack composure in front of goal on Saturday and there was generally a lack of a cutting edge up front. For that reason I'd like to see Jackson given a good run out, if not a start. Surely there is room in a game like this for Scotland, Peaso and Jacko. I'd drop Milne to the bench.

[rickardo]

Watch out for east fifes right back Davie Ross (Bundy) tonight the guy is a complete loony but a braw player, i work with the helmit so loads of abuse fired in his direction would be very much appreciated THANK YOU :***:

[Up The Duff]

Perfect chance to play Jackson and Peaso/Savo up front with Jase behind them. Dont know why Owen hasnt at least tried that in a game before.

[Maradona]

Should be a easy victory but as we all know it tends not to be with Saints think it will be a good match anyway few goals hopefuly

[Real Madrid]

I'm just in the door from Vancouver, via Calgary, London and Edinburgh in the last 25 hours and going to this game so it better be good :***:

Hope we turn on the style

3-0 Saints

[sAiNtE BrIaN]

can people post the scores to please

[Saintly Child]

0-0 so far 26mins played

[Saintly Child]

QOS are 2 up against Clyde after 17mins.

Are we good or bad?

[john1962]

Halliwell
Lawrie
McManus
Rutkiewicz
Dyer
Stanic
Mensing
Hardie
Sheerin
Milne
Scotland

Young
MacDonald
Stevenson
Jackson
Cuthbert

[Tarvie]

QOS are 2 up against Clyde after 17mins.

Are we good or bad?

Queens Park are 1-0 up on Hamilton, are Gretna that good :twisted: or are Hamilton that bad :***:

[sAiNtE BrIaN]

:D well done hahaha **claps**

[Tarvie]

Mixu's Maniacs are 4-0 up (10 in 2 games) the mans onto something here

[sAiNtE BrIaN]

QOS ARE UP 3-0 :evil: :shock:

OH O

[Saintly Child]

QOS 4-1 CLYDE HT

[sAiNtE BrIaN]

notice that we have more to talk about queens and clyde than we do saints :?

[Tarvie]

No news is good news :wink:

[The Real Saints]

According to the official website, East Fife have dominated the first half. :(

[The Real Saints]

Milne off for MacDonald.
Dyer off for Young.

[john1962]

1-0 Jason

[john1962]

2-0 Hardie

[Coltrane]

Whew..I was beginning to get a bit worried

[john1962]

Dont

3-0 Jason

[Saintly Child]

WooohOOO Scum are out.
Partick beat them again. 3-1

[Saintly Child]

Saints 3 - 1 East Fife

[chopper]

Attendance 1222

O'Reilly scored for them

[chopper]

Jackson for Scotland 79 mins

[chopper]

Full time:

St Johnstone 3 (Scotland, Hardie, Scotland)
East Fife 1 (O'Reilly}

Att: 1,222

Other scores:

Albion Rovers 1 Stenhousemuir 2
Brechin City 2 Morton 1
Cowdenbeath 4 East Stirlingshire 1
Dumbarton 3 Stirling Albion 0
Dundee 1 Partick Thistle 3
Forfar Athletic 1 Alloa Athletic 2 (extra time being played)
Queen of the South 4 Clyde 2 (latest)
Queens Park 1 Hamilton Academicals 1 (extra time being played)
Raith Rovers 1 Airdrie United 2
Ross County 4 Stranraer 2

[Saintly Child]

Saints 3 -1 East Fife FT.

At least it's a win.

[Radford 72]

QOS are 2 up against Clyde after 17mins.

Are we good or bad?
Speaking to someone at the Clyde game, the Bully Wee supposedly were much the better side but their 'keeper had a nightmare. Said we should have no problems dealing with them.

[Radford 72]

I see to be the first back and that wasn't pretty. First-half we were nothing short of disgraceful but we managed to pick the tempo up a bit in the second-half and started moving the ball around better and moving off it better.

Great turn then pass to set up Jason for his first, which he cooly finished. A few minutes later Hardie met a back post cross with a looping header which saw their 'keeper do a Cuthbert impression then a nice pass from Peanut set Jason up for the third, which he rounded the 'keeper for.

They pulled one back from a corner then Jacko came on and further showed just how much potential he has.

Best for us was Derek Young, quite a few under-par performances though but still earlier days.

[Cagey]

Apart from the 10 min scoring burst ,that was dire.

Can`t make my mind up if changing to 4 2 4 improved things or the introduction of Young & McDonald. I think it was a bit of both.

I think we have to give Savo a rest. He has always been one of my favourites ,mainly due to his workrate but Jacko did more in the 10 mins he was on than Savo did the whole of the first half.

A few failures tonight but wont go into that just now.

[Hazel1884]

Pretty much agree with Radford's post above on the performace - VERY slow to get going (and sometimes, just not good enough!) but things picked up in the second half with Young showing some nice touches and pushing us forward a bit.

As for the goals, Jason's finishing for the two were good but i thought Jason's second was offside.

Jacko still has the enthusiasm that a youngster should have when breaking through - and really livened up our attack when he came on.

Tad worried at how shaky our defence was though - any reason why Big Bambi wasnae playing? He injured? :? Few times we were sliced open and passes going astray.

No real standouts tonight tbh - not sure wether Mensing is the answer to mdfield at the moment, however will reserve judgement till he has possibly settled in this role if he is given a few more games in it.

P.S What a relief to see a Saints game without Weir in the squad! :***: :wink:

[208saint]

Crap, rubbish, worse than Saturday, but then again it's just the start of the season and we shouldn't get wound up about performances just yet. :roll:

First half was diabolical, numerous times we had the ball on the halfway line and the only people looking for space and the ball were the other feckin defenders. Have they forgotten that Stevo isn't on the right any more? They continue to go through the middle or down the left, although to be fair Lawrie does next to nothing when he does get the ball, did he beat a man tonight?

Why the feck did Owen decide we needed to play such a defensive formation against East Fife?

IMHO we were a couple of baw hairs away from embarrassment tonight.

Am no happy and it needs sorted quickly.

Mind you there's always next season :***:

[208saint]

I think we have to give Savo a rest.

You're havin a laugh, it' only the second game of the season. Christ imagine going to your work on a Monday morning for an eight o'clock start and tellin the gaffer you need a rest by half past, get real.

[Radford 72]

As for the goals, Jason's finishing for the two were good but i thought Jason's second was offside.

Tad worried at how shaky our defence was though - any reason why Big Bambi wasnae playing? He injured? :?
Yeah, I agree, pretty sure Jason was offside for the third.

Both Kevin James and Shez were injured.

I think we showed them a lack of respect in the first-half and that isn't acceptable. To beat a team like that you need to pass-and-move quickly, that's where quality shines through.

Major plus point has to be Derek Young, I hope he starts on Saturday if he's fit enough.

[Super J]

Agree that the first half was shocking but the second half was like night and day. Thought that the passing and movement was good and the ball was spread across the pitch much more.

I am not a fan of 3-5-2 at all and thought the 4-3-1-2 was much more effective and allowed us to be more attack-minded (which we should certainly be against East Fife and the majority of teams in this league). Would love to see Coyle stick to this for Dumfries on Saturday but fear we will go back to the 3-5-2 which in my opinion got us nowhere on Saturday or in the first half tonight. I envisage a reaction such 'as it got us to second last season and we finished top scorers' but from the evidence of the second half tonight, if it's not broken why fix it!

Also, have to agree that Milne has been pretty ineffective. He does a lot of running but it rarely produces anything. Although some people label Scotland lasy he can still change a game for us with a moment of brilliance.

[Radford 72]

Agree that the first half was shocking but the second half was like night and day. Thought that the passing and movement was good and the ball was spread across the pitch much more.

I am not a fan of 3-5-2 at all and thought the 4-3-1-2 was much more effective and allowed us to be more attack-minded (which we should certainly be against East Fife and the majority of teams in this league). Would love to see Coyle stick to this for Dumfries on Saturday but fear we will go back to the 3-5-2 which in my opinion got us nowhere on Saturday or in the first half tonight. I envisage a reaction such 'as it got us to second last season and we finished top scorers' but from the evidence of the second half tonight, if it's not broken why fix it!
You said yourself though that the passing and movement in the second period was better so I think the formation was largely irrelevant. It's far more important we play with that tempo than with any specific formation.

I thought the midfield tonight struggled with the 3-5-2 but we started with only two in the middle and Jason in the hole and Simon isn't really a midfielder and Sheerin couldn't do much himself in that deep role.

With Shez back in there alongside hopefully Sheerin and Young, I think we'd see better movement and passing.

[Super J]

We played a similar formation down at Stranraer last October and I thought that was some of the best football we played all season, albeit we didn't win the game, still created plenty chances. I personally think that having three defenders is a waste and that the introduction of Young as an extra attacking player made all the difference.

[Broon]

If Coyle sticks with the same players and this 5-3-2 it will eventually get him the sack. Thank god he changed it at half time as we were on our way out of the cup. We had a back 5, and Sheerin and Mensing sitting right on top of them. No wonder we had no space - it was like watching school football. Our defence still looks like they don't know each other and the keeper was a bombscare (what the hell is his kicking all about?).

Second half was much improved. A nice balanced 442 or 4-3-1-2 (not sure where Hardie was playing). Young stayed far away from the defence and let Mensing fill the gap. Sheerin played better as he had more space as Young spread the Fife midfield around. Some good through balls by Young and some nice passing.

Peaso played very well when he came on. He comes short for the ball and links with the Midfield. We look far less disjointed when he is in the side. His goal was onside too. Jacko looked great when he came on, nice touches and skinned his man twice in 2 mins. Scotland was just Scotland - awful but got 2 goals. I will take it every time.

One point about Milne - how little does the guy contribute? I would have Jacko, Peaso and Scotland all in front of him in the queue, no question.

[SaintSam1884]

It was pretty dire tonight to be honest.

I absolutely hate the way Saints sit back after they feel they've taken the game to a point that it'd be impossible for the opposition to come back from. At 3-0 we took our foot off the gas, concentration slipped, it was back to 3-1 and East Fife still looked dangerous. Infact, it's pretty disgraceful and is what will put Gretna ahead of us this season more than anything else.

It's all wrong, is that.

[Radford 72]

We played a similar formation down at Stranraer last October and I thought that was some of the best football we played all season, albeit we didn't win the game, still created plenty chances. I personally think that having three defenders is a waste and that the introduction of Young as an extra attacking player made all the difference.
You could do that by just leaving Simon Mensing out though.

The problem we have is we have just signed a specialised sweeper and a specialised right wing-back, and our captain can only really play in a back three.

I really don't think changing the formation is an option or would help us as we have no natural width in any case.

The problems in the first-half tonight were nothing to do with the formation IMO.

[Broon]

I really don't think changing the formation is an option or would help us as we have no natural width in any case.

The problems in the first-half tonight were nothing to do with the formation IMO.

You say changing from 5-3-2 would give us no width yet when we went 4-3-1-2 we got down the line far more (Lawrie, Hardie, Stanic, Sheerin).

[Radford 72]

I really don't think changing the formation is an option or would help us as we have no natural width in any case.

The problems in the first-half tonight were nothing to do with the formation IMO.
You say changing from 5-3-2 would give us no width yet when we went 4-3-1-2 we got down the line far more (Lawrie, Hardie, Stanic, Sheerin).
I would still say Lawrie and Stanic were playing much further forward than conventional full-backs in the second-half.

I appreciate the forum is about discussion but for me, I can't see any way in which Coyle, after two games, will ditch the formation he's specifically brought players in for.

[Broon]

I appreciate the forum is about discussion but for me, I can't see any way in which Coyle, after two games, will ditch the formation he's specifically brought players in for.

I know he is not going to change from 5-3-2, as he has built his team around this formation. Thats not to say its not a mistake. We don't need 3 central defenders in this league, we have no midfield. It wasn't good enough last season and its probably not going to be good enough this season either. Maybe if he starts with Peaso and Young the formation may look better - I really hope so.

[Victor]

Anyone want to join me in a new online game...Spot The Hypocrite???

All you need to do is pick out the forumers who were slagging the disgaceful 'moaners' after saturdays game with comments such as..you cant moan after only one game..you can only moan after a month...etc etc.

3 days and one game later, there they are...moaning themselves. Double standards or what.

Thats 2 games played...1 win, 1 draw...only 1 goal conceded and a late one at that...through to next round of a national competition...long awaited new keeper settling in...possible solution to midfield problem getting match fit.....c'mon hypocrites, positive positive.

[Shaggy Jenkins]

I wouldn't be starting Jackson for this one - I think it's more important to get our recognised strikers playing well than to give youngsters a run out...
He's a first team squad player so if tonight isn't a chance to play him, when is?

He's proved with Cowdenbeath and Forfar he can play against teams of this level so let him have a chance with us.

People questioned Clark when he first started playing Parker and he took his chance amazingly well.

Im thinking he's nippy, fast feet looks to look like he can and wants to beat a man....maybe worth a shot as proper winger?

[Radford 72]

I know he is not going to change from 5-3-2, as he has built his team around this formation. Thats not to say its not a mistake. We don't need 3 central defenders in this league, we have no midfield. It wasn't good enough last season and its probably not going to be good enough this season either. Maybe if he starts with Peaso and Young the formation may look better - I really hope so.
Every champion in our time in this league has played with a back three so it can work in this league. Our problem isn't with a back three (although ours lacks a wee bit of pace), it's with the midfield which was shite in the first-half tonight.

I think Young could make a difference, in the short-term when he is hungry to impress at least.

[saint10]

Thought we were pretty bad in the first half mostly due to the formation and the way the players played the system. Better in the second half.

The reason Peaso looked so much better at linking with the midfield than Milne was because in the first part of the first half Scotland was sitting behind Milne and Hardie taking up the space that a striker would usually come in to take the ball short to feet. But peaso should start in front of milne because hes a better player overall.

People at the game didn't seem to realise that passing it about for 5 minutes at the back with the midfield involved is how good teams play, drawing east fife out then making the attacking move when theres space. But the defense panicked a bit thinking we've passed it about a bit, lets hump it and loose it.

Id play a 4-4-2 with hardie right mid, young and mensing centre mid, sheerin left, scotland and peaso upfront. Or play hardie as more of an attacking player and mensing can cover for him.

[templeofsaints]

Temple reports up now but FWIW I can only echo what's being said here.

Pluses -
Derek Young looked as sharp as anyone in the squad when he came on.
Hardie added a bit more push to the midfield.
Jason scored a couple of good goals even if the ref helped his 2nd! :roll:

Minuses -
Rustybitz looked nervous and struggled to link with Lawrie.
Dyer was out of his depth at centre-half for long spells. Maybe he would have done better with James alongside him but can't complain about the way McManus played.
Halliwell had one good save but looked dodgy at times - seems to be very little communication with his defence (as shown by the way McManus cleared a ball that should have been the keepers late on).
Lawrie still flattered to deceive - too often in the 1st half he'd get the ball in space, hesitate and then play it back to a defender rather than try and beat his man. Looks very poor when you compare him to Stanic on the other wing.

Still we're through which is the main thing.

[mainstand]

Anyone want to join me in a new online game...Spot The Hypocrite???

All you need to do is pick out the forumers who were slagging the disgaceful 'moaners' after saturdays game with comments such as..you cant moan after only one game..you can only moan after a month...etc etc.

3 days and one game later, there they are...moaning themselves. Double standards or what.

Thats 2 games played...1 win, 1 draw...only 1 goal conceded and a late one at that...through to next round of a national competition...long awaited new keeper settling in...possible solution to midfield problem getting match fit.....c'mon hypocrites, positive positive.

Victor couldn't agree more. If someone had offered you a 3-1 victory before last nights match I am sure most would have taken it.

Couldn't believe one guy last night who constantly clagged off the players and even shouted and slagged off jason that his second was yards offside. :shock:

[Radford 72]

Victor couldn't agree more.
I think he's being sarcastic! :wink:

[Radford 72]

Just reading the East Fife forum are there are comments along the lines of that's their best performance (first-half anyway) for about three years, so maybe we shouldn't be too harsh on Saints? Still maintain tempo was all wrong but it shows they raised their game.

Claims their goal was an own goal?

[Broggy Man]

Now I didnt get to the Clyde game so that was my first competitive game this season.

Woofull pays to much of a compliment to Saints first half performance.

Paul Sheerin take note your delivery from open play into the box is the best ive seen maybe Simon Lappin apart. Why why why can you not pass the bloody ball to a Saints player. You are not a play maker and never will be one. Your dead ball delivery is terrible.

Lawrie non existant as an attacking force first half. Stanic Im wondering if a small positional change is needed for Goran. He seems to be the only player who ventures into the middle of the park who can commit and beat a player creating space.

Im not doom and gloom but if that was what the Clyde game was like it is going to be a long cold winter. I hope upon hope that young stays for the long term and McDonald stays fit because that was two players who seemed on the face of it to change the game and Young actually brought Jason into the game as for most of the early part he was recieving the ball surounded by players and either his touch was letting him down or he was being crowded out.

Anyway I hope there is some other people in the pipeline as OC says.

[wee john]

Not convinced on Lawrie yet.
His movement and awareness are poor and other players were constantly telling him to move last night.
Needs to give himself a wee shake.
Maybe he is always like that, if he is he will not last long.

[dunblanemike]

Paul Sheerin take note your delivery from open play into the box is the best ive seen maybe Simon Lappin apart. Why why why can you not pass the bloody ball to a Saints player. You are not a play maker and never will be one. Your dead ball delivery is terrible.


?????? - so was he good or bad???????

Has anyone wondered if Lawrie was told to not go hurtling up the wing by the management? It's all very well slagging players if you know they were not following instructions but how many of us actually know what Lawrie was asked to do?
I really wish I could have sat in the East stand on my own - the running negative commentary from the guys behind me did my head in. At least when the east stand is open I know not to sit in the blue seats so avoiding the whingers but having to sit in the west stand is a bit of a lottery as far as moaners is concerned.
Oh yes..... at least we know that Victor is Mr consistent and would never be a hypocrite - you have to live up to your name after all!! :***:

[mon_the_Fife]

A good game last night but we were punished for not taking our chances in the first half and had atleast 3 clear cut chances which could have saw us a few goals up at half time.

We changed to a 4-3-3 in the first half which caused your defence problems and they were stuggling with the pace of John Martin.

Going in 0-0 at half time, I thought our chance had gone as St Johnstone will come out a better team. I don't know whay Baikie changed to a 4-5-1 formation and invited pressure on us as we only had Paul Ritchie upfront who isn't the paciest anymore. I could tell in the first few minutes of the 2nd half that the goals were coming and Scotland took both his well.

The 2 quickfire goals knocked the stuffing out of us for a bit and the floodgates could have opened but we gradually came back into it when we reverted to a 4-4-2 instead of only 1 upfront.

We played some nice football and made Halliwell pull off a few good saves so overall not disappointed with the performance if we can play like that we should do well this season, but off to Cliftonhill this week where the pitch is a little different :roll:

CIS Cup is a diddy cup anyway... Roll on the Challenge Cup :P

[Broon]

Claims their goal was an own goal?

I thought Stanic put in in myself. You could tell after it that he wanted to make amends and was coming forward alot more.

[Broon]

I really wish I could have sat in the East stand on my own - the running negative commentary from the guys behind me did my head in. At least when the east stand is open I know not to sit in the blue seats so avoiding the whingers but having to sit in the west stand is a bit of a lottery as far as moaners is concerned.
Oh yes..... at least we know that Victor is Mr consistent and would never be a hypocrite - you have to live up to your name after all!! :***:

I'm not being funny but you seriously can't blame folk for moaning last night? I was having a right good moan, but only about the things that never seem to change. Its gets frustrating seeing 5 players clumped in the centre circle when we gather possession at the back. It happens all the time, the defenders get the ball and the midfielders run towards them - Sheerin being the biggest culprit. If you didn't have one wee moan last night then you must be the calmest most passive person ever ever ever ;)

[wee john]

Has anyone wondered if Lawrie was told to not go hurtling up the wing by the management? It's all very well slagging players if you know they were not following instructions but how many of us actually know what Lawrie was asked to do?
:***:

You could clearly see other players getting frustrated by his lack of movement.
Scotland twice puts balls into positions where Lawrie should have been but he never moved.
Young told him more than once to move.
I don't mean hurtling up the wing, I mean his touch and movement looking for a return or creating the space, he just wasn't up to play in that respect.
He may have just been out of sorts, but with the system we play he has to touch, move and create, hopefully he can.

[dunblanemike]

[ It happens all the time, the defenders get the ball and the midfielders run towards them - Sheerin being the biggest culprit. If you didn't have one wee moan last night then you must be the calmest most passive person ever ever ever ;)
ah, so you are advocating the schoolboy footie favourite of all the players running upfield for a long punt! You watch any good side and I'll guarantee that at least one player will run towards the guy with the ball. This gives the player with the ball another option and/or pulls a defending player out to leave space behind them.
Me passive..... no, just waaaay cool man! 8) I got most annoyed with the running commentary in the second half when we were playing possession football and drawing out the EF defence. We were playing then the type of footie that you have to play to win against teams like EF.

[Broon]

ah, so you are advocating the schoolboy footie favourite of all the players running upfield for a long punt! You watch any good side and I'll guarantee that at least one player will run towards the guy with the ball.

Not advocating everyone running upfield - no way. Let me paint you a picture: Ruti has the ball 20 yards from the halfway line and starts bringing it forward, Sheerin is 10 yards inside the opposition half. Instead of making space for the pass from Ruti (by shaking off his marker side to side or going wide or moving inside his man) he runs towards Ruti (taking his marker with him) and takes the ball off Ruti's toe. He then has to turn round and find a man (and is in exactly the same position as Ruti yet with one less midfielder to pass to). Whats the point? Why not stay where he is and let Ruti make the pass forward?

I see what you are saying with good teams though. When Viera does it he will generally turn round and charge into the oppositions half, committing players until he finds a loose man. Sherrin will never be able to do that.

[blueheaven]

Awful in the first half, as everyone else has said - had East Fife's shooting been a bit better we could have gone in at half-time a goal or two down and it would have been panic stations time. East Fife's players were'nt great, but they seemed to want it more and grew in confidence as the half went on. Have to say I was sort of expecting us to struggle in that one though - this is the sort of game that, traditionally, we often seem to have no idea how to handle.

Second half was much improved, thanks I think to bringing on Young (very impressive performance from him) and Peaso (why didn't he start anyway? He's streets ahead of Milne). Even then, though, we weren't great and if East Fife had snuck a second when they had their short spell of pressure towards the end it would have been a very nervy finish.

Jackson looked lively when he came on, and despite what I've said further up the thread I'd now have him ahead of Milne for a place in the team, based on current form. McManus was good again too, and it was good to see Hardie back although he seemed a bit out of practice as some of his ball control was appaling.

Have to say I've been pretty disappointed by Lawrie so far though. I wouldn't be looking at dropping him yet because I think we need to show him a bit of patience, but based on what I've seen so far I actually think Stevenson's a better option in that position - Stevenson is more energetic, gets forward better, offers more penetration, is more likely to get a few goals and generally poses opponents more of a threat.

[dunblanemike]

[Whats the point? Why not stay where he is and let Ruti make the pass forward?


but don't most of Ruti's passes end up at the goalkeeper or over Stanic's head on the opposite touchline? Sheerin does at least find a player most of the time (but don't we moan when he does not!!). There should however be a bit of variety - it should not be the same player doing the fetching all the time.

[Broon]

[Whats the point? Why not stay where he is and let Ruti make the pass forward?


but don't most of Ruti's passes end up at the goalkeeper or over Stanic's head on the opposite touchline? Sheerin does at least find a player most of the time (but don't we moan when he does not!!). There should however be a bit of variety - it should not be the same player doing the fetching all the time.

The reason Ruti punts it is because Sheerin and the other midfielders don't make space for the short pass as they come too narrow.

[1884]

Lawrie still flattered to deceive - too often in the 1st half he'd get the ball in space, hesitate and then play it back to a defender rather than try and beat his man. Looks very poor when you compare him to Stanic on the other wing.

I thought that was just a pre-season thing cos that just about sums up his pre-season games but looks like that's the way he plays all the time. :roll: Definitely a poor man's Stanic.

[Victor]

I think he's being sarcastic! :wink:
Ironic Radders, ironic! At least part of it was anyway!

Oh yes..... at least we know that Victor is Mr consistent and would never be a hypocrite - you have to live up to your name after all!!
Indeed Mike. Hope I havent been hypocritical...perhaps just critical when the need arises!!

Nobody remembers the non critical posts though. Its like the old joke - you shagga one sheep...... :(

[Radford 72]

Nobody remembers the non critical posts though. Its like the old joke - you shagga one sheep...... :(
Surely it's the inverse of the sheep story? :P

[dunblanemike]

Indeed Mike. Hope I havent been hypocritical...perhaps just critical when the need arises!!

Nobody remembers the non critical posts though. Its like the old joke - you shagga one sheep...... :(

you're right.... I don't remember any non-critical posts. Maybe that should read hyper-critical!! :***: :P

[garydavidson]

East Fife had a guy called Blackadder playing for them :***:

This season is a bit of a change from the start of last season from what i have read it sounds like owen is going to have some ass kicking to do to get the players going.

Looking forward to the Partick games so i can at least get to two games this season :0)

[Cagey]

I think we have to give Savo a rest.

You're havin a laugh, it' only the second game of the season. Christ imagine going to your work on a Monday morning for an eight o'clock start and tellin the gaffer you need a rest by half past, get real.

Politically correct way of saying we should drop him. McDonald & Jackson are miles ahead of him now as nothing is happening for Savo just now .I don`t know if the style of play doesn`t suit him or he has lost confidence but he certainly isn`t producing the goods. Maybe he would have played better in the second half with the new system.

[Victor]

Nobody remembers the non critical posts though. Its like the old joke - you shagga one sheep...... :(
Surely it's the inverse of the sheep story? :P
Dont think so.I think its similar because we are both remembered for one thing no matter what else has been said/done.
Ive had numerous positive posts but get comments that I am negative all the time. eg from a few days ago-I think that is a very positive statement as to me it means that even if he had personal doubts about a player, he has backed his managers judgement and let the signing go ahead. Although I am not Geoffs greatest fan, full marks to him for letting the manager manage.
Anyway, Im not negative...just realistic! Big difference!!! :wink:

you're right.... I don't remember any non-critical posts. Maybe that should read hyper-critical!!
An aide memoire above Mike...and you are of course correct about my error. It was a typer!! :)

[Radford 72]

Claims their goal was an own goal?
I thought Stanic put in in myself. You could tell after it that he wanted to make amends and was coming forward alot more.
Came off Ruti's heel supposedly. Oweny has called it "a freak goal"! :roll:

[Kevin]

Claims their goal was an own goal?
I thought Stanic put in in myself. You could tell after it that he wanted to make amends and was coming forward alot more.
Came off Ruti's heel supposedly. Oweny has called it "a freak goal"! :roll:

None of us on the gantry could tell who scored, which is why there was no announcement. It was given to O'Reilly as he appeared to have claimed it.

[Radford 72]

None of us on the gantry could tell who scored, which is why there was no announcement. It was given to O'Reilly as he appeared to have claimed it.
No shame there, Kevin. I had no idea who scored it either and the fact no one on here picked up on it either suggests you won't get your wages docked! :wink:

[Kevin]

None of us on the gantry could tell who scored, which is why there was no announcement. It was given to O'Reilly as he appeared to have claimed it.
No shame there, Kevin. I had no idea who scored it either and the fact no one on here picked up on it either suggests you won't get your wages docked! :wink:

Wages??

[SaintSam1884]

Ah but one of the boys I went to the game with told me it was an own goal and we were further away than both you and Radford, Kevin! 8)

[perthandproud]

Well i thought it was deffenitely an own goal, it seemed to roll up Ruti and go in and afterwards he had his head down while walking away and some of the others talking to him.

[Cagey]

None of us on the gantry could tell who scored, which is why there was no announcement. It was given to O'Reilly as he appeared to have claimed it.
No shame there, Kevin. I had no idea who scored it either and the fact no one on here picked up on it either suggests you won't get your wages docked! :wink:

Did i hear the sub announced as Ryan Stevenson instead of Jacko or was I hearing things Kevin.

[Kevin]

None of us on the gantry could tell who scored, which is why there was no announcement. It was given to O'Reilly as he appeared to have claimed it.
No shame there, Kevin. I had no idea who scored it either and the fact no one on here picked up on it either suggests you won't get your wages docked! :wink:

Did i hear the sub announced as Ryan Stevenson instead of Jacko or was I hearing things Kevin.

You were defo hearing things Cagey! Andy Jackson was the announcement 8)

[Linky]

Young should be signed up on a longer contract straight away, he was brilliant. I thought Dyer was really good for his age too.
Still, we are too often punting it up the field and we haven't got the height from the strikers to deal with it in any constructive way.