Saints vs. Hamilton 19/08/2006

[imported_Jamie_Beatson]

Any thoughts on this one? Hoping to continue our unbeaten run, and will be disappointed if we can't take all three points to be honest.

Jamie

[LewGti]

I will be there. The games are coming thick and fast at the moment, its great. I dread to think how many miles i have dont so far this season, but i aint complaining :D

As for the game, I hope Milne starts after his efforts on Tuesday night. Would like to see Young get a start too also after a good display aswell. Is Ruti gonna make it?

I would like to see,

Halliwell
Ruti McManus James
Mensing Young Sheerin Stanic
Scotland
Milne Peaso

[Radford 72]

Still don't think we're in top gear so can see another result like the ones that killed us last season. 1-1 with them scoring first.

I'd guess Savo will come back in for Hardie with Ando replacing Ruti and then it being the same team as last Saturday with Young still cooling his heels on the bench.

[dave mc]

Can see Mensing dropping back for Rusty,Hardie back for him and Savo up front,really hope we play at a good tempo and pass and move like we can.Hard to choose between Young and Hardie in the middle,but think we'll go with the stronger and more imposing Hardie.


Halliwell

Mensing McManus James

Lawrie Hardie Sheridan Sheerin Stanic

Scotland Milne

[Broon]

I'm looking forward to this one. We have had a fairly solid start without playing well so I predict we hit some form tomorrow. Should be comfortable in the end.

Line up:

Halliwell

Mensing McManus James

Lawrie Hardie Young Sheerin Stanic

Scotland Peaso

I just noticed Lawrie and Hardie :) :)

[Shibbydoo]

Any news yet guys?

[Shibbydoo]

Gretna & Partick both one up. Are these our two biggest rivals this year?

[pezza70]

Young on for Sheridan on 56th mins

[Shibbydoo]

Any idea how we've been playing Pezza?

[pezza70]

Im in Sydney mate, no idea, just going of the sky sports website

[Shibbydoo]

Doh!!! Sorry man.

[pezza70]

:D

[Shibbydoo]

Just the one booking?

Makes a change this season so far.

[pezza70]

Anderson for McManus on 71 mins

[Saintly Child]

Looks like another poor result. :(

[Saintly Child]

Meadowbank 1- 1 Patrick

[pezza70]

Peaso for Savo on 79 mins

[Saintly Child]

Meadowbank 1 -2 Jags

[Saintly Child]

Scotland sent off Sell Him.

[Shibbydoo]

Jason Scotland red-card. Violent conduct. F**k sake!!!

[pezza70]

Jason sent off for Violent conduct on 86 mins :shock:

[Saintly Child]

Probably reacted to getting kicked round the park.

Give others a chance to impress now he is banned.

[Saintly Child]

Saints 0 - 0 Hamilton . Another 2 points dropped, and now 4 behind the leaders.


Poor Stuff. Teams who don't win their home games don't win titles. :(

[pezza70]

Full time scores

Airdrie 2 - QoS 2

Gretna 2 - Ross Cou 1

Livi 2 - Partick 2

Saintees 0 - Hamilton 0 :(

[Rodgers]

Would say it was a sending off but if that guy was pushing me like he did to Scotland, i would of turned around a punched the **** :evil:

[Rodgers]

What style of play does coyle actually want to play?

I watched todays game and just wonder whats going on?
They played loads of long balls today up to our strikers and time after time the ball gets headed back to our defence. You can play balls in the air when you have small strikers, put two and two together!!
But when the ball is on the ground, they decide to take there time, its like no one wants to play. I can agree with some build up play, spreading the ball etc but sometimes its just a joke! They need tp start linking play up and make their play faster, i.e one twos!!!Am not saying all this because am not behind the team because i am, its just a bit worring when you keep drawing at home :(

[Radford 72]

Same old story. A new season but the same shite served up.

Scotland elbowed the bloke but the guy was all over the back of him. He at least deserves credit though for not making a meal of it.

This kicking the ball out of play thing needs looked at.

[SaintSam1884]

Jason Scotland elbowed a Hamilton player in the face. I was initially surprised that the referee had awarded us a free kick and took no action against Scotland. However, it soon became obvious that the referee hadn't seen the incident but the linesman had his flag up. As soon as you realised the linesman was bringing it to the attention of the referee, I'd be amused if anyone was genuinely shocked to see Scotland shown red. He was reacting to the mauling that he had been receiving, but that's not the way to do it and he was deservedly sent off. Not only has he let himself down, he has let his team mates down who had to play on without him, having used all of our substitutions, and who now have to play without him next week.

I am struggling to find words to describe our performance today. I could start with analysing the team that Owen Coyle fielded which was wrong in my opinion, and from the very start it was the Clyde game all over again.

Halliwell

McManus James Stanic

Lawrie Hardie Mensing Sheridan Sheerin

Milne Scotland

Personally, I think I would've moved Mensing back into defence and left Stanic alongside Sheerin. Moving him back would've been a better option than having him and Sheridan fighting to play the same role again, and cutting away Stanic from the attacks. I thought Sheridan had an especially poor game and could see today some of the things wee john said about him in his thread a couple of weeks ago. He has always struck me as an integral part of our midfield but today he was more of a hindrance than a help until he was rightly substituted in favour of Young.

Sheerin was impressive again I felt, not really got a bad word to say about his performance today. Having Stanic removed from alongside him wasn't a great move and slowed us down on the left I felt but he improvised and used Scotland and some of the play between these two was pretty impressive. Hardie is a strange one, he doesn't impress me. I'm not going to be harsh on him because I just don't get him. I don't get what he's all about, what he brings to the team, what he's got, what he lacks. I just don't get it, I didn't see anything impressive today. He's strong though, but... Yeah, maybe someone can explain it to me.

I'm quite proud of how Mensing has adapted to his new role although as previously stated, it would've been a better idea to have him at the back today with Rutkiewicz missing. Maybe if Mensing and Sheridan hadn't been playing together in the same midfield, Sheridan would've played better? Whatever the case may be, I think it's a mega bad, bad, bad idea to have these two playing together.

Lawrie gets a paragraph of his own. I watched him in pre-season and thought he was garbage but Radford urged me to give him a chance, and so I bit my tongue. However, today, I was physically sickened by this player. He cannot tackle, he cannot run, he cannot pass. He's absolutely hopeless. He's playing on the right side of a five man midfield but he can neither get forward nor get back. Instead, he remains totally static and hides from the game. He's the biggest bottler I've ever clapped eyes on during a match. I'll be damned if I saw him take on a player and get to the line or even remotely near it once today. Owen Coyle rightly removed Sheridan from the middle of the park when it was clear he wasn't playing to his usual standards, but left Lawrie down the side despite it being clear he was the biggest liability on the park. I don't give a flying f'ck if he's the only player that can naturally play that position. I'd rather stick Steven Anderson or Ryan Stevenson in there any day of the week than watch someone as utterly dreadful as Andy Lawrie just because he's the only player that calls that position his own.

I thought Young looked quite lively when he came on although was a bit disadvantaged coming into a side that wasn't playing well and against a team that's quite hard in the tackle. Upfront we had Tuesdays hero Milne who resorted back to his usual headless chicken style endless running today although as the weeks go by, I'm more and more convinced that it's because he's playing next to Jason Scotland and these two are just planets apart on the field. He played so well on Tuesday night, but today he was just detached. I felt quite sorry for the guy but Jason Scotland for me was having a total stormer before his dismissal. The strength and skill on this bloke is completely amazing to watch. For me, he was the standout in our side by far and yet again looked the only player with any real threat about him. If we were going to score at any point today, it was going to be him that did it. His attitude to the game has improved.

Other things that annoyed me today? Set piece play, Tuesday nights was a marked improvement on anything we've produced with Sheridan and today - when he slotted straight back into the team and straight back into designated set piece taker - we became totally hopeless at them again. It's clear as day that the one person always aimed for is Kevin James. Reality check, despite having a seven foot freak in the 18 yard box at set pieces, we're about as threatening as a hamster.

Worst game I've seen this season - preseason included - by a mile. The loss of McManus - which I hope isn't serious because he's solid - saw a bad day get worse and the ordering off of Scotland just put the icing on the cake.

208Saint, Victor.... You have been granted permission to moan. Moan for Britain. :roll:

Two weeks into the season and we're already four points behind Gretna, but what is even more worrying is that Gretna slaughtered Hamilton. Whether you choose to read anything into that is of course your prerogative but we have issues and the blame unfortunately lies with Coyle.

[SJC]

Scotland usually looks lazy, but today was a disgrace, sent off for elbowing the Hamilton twice for no real justification, clean through on the keeper twice with no result and looking as disinterested as I have ever seen.
Hardie had a go at him before he was sent off, probably gave him the excuse to go home early.
Hopefully Jackson will start the next game, but it'll probably be Peaso and Milne.
Save yourself the bother of reading the match report, if you read the report of the game v Clyde then this was identical.
McManus punted the ball 10 yards past the striker every time he had time on the ball, Milne did nothing, which isn't his fault because what the hell can he do trying to control a 50 yard punt with 3 defenders marking him and no Saints player making any kind of supporting run.
Lawrie did nothing either, fell over the advertising board when trying to take a shy and was put on his arse trying to tackle Hamiltons wee bugger of a winger, Anderson must start instead of this guy because he has shown nothing.

Long way to go but the problems are obvious again, draws at home cost us the league last season and it's started once again.

[Radford 72]

I am struggling to find words to describe our performance today. I could start with analysing the team that Owen Coyle fielded which was wrong in my opinion, and from the very start it was the Clyde game all over again.

Halliwell

McManus James Stanic

Lawrie Hardie Mensing Sheridan Sheerin

Milne Scotland
That would be fine but we played 4-4-2 today!

[SaintSam1884]

I'd disagree entirely about Scotland, I thought he was playing really well and was the one standout in our side until his dismissal. I appreciate that the chances he had today, he would've buried on any other day but I don't think he deliberately missed them because he "couldn't be arsed". He did a lot more running and put a lot more effort in to keeping the ball than I have ever seen him do. Many occasions today he fought for it when last season he'd have let it go, and complained to an uncaring referee.

[SaintSam1884]

I am struggling to find words to describe our performance today. I could start with analysing the team that Owen Coyle fielded which was wrong in my opinion, and from the very start it was the Clyde game all over again.

Halliwell

McManus James Stanic

Lawrie Hardie Mensing Sheridan Sheerin

Milne Scotland
That would be fine but we played 4-4-2 today!

Didn't see four at the back until Scotland was sent off. Maybe we were supposed to be playing 4-4-2, but nobody told Andy Lawrie that, who sat directly opposite Sheerin all day, well... He may as well have been sitting. That's what I saw!

[SJC]

Disagree with you about Scotland, if moaning at the ref is what he's paid to do then he's some player.

I've usually defended his lazy style but today was too much for me, didn't chase a thing down, just stood in the centre circle before making a half arsed attempt at running with the ball.

He should have squared the ball to Milne when he was clean through for the first time, after what was a great turn by him to create the chance. After that he did the opposite, play the ball all the time instead of shooting.

He did stand out, but because Hamiltons defenders were paying him some particularly close attention, his constant moaning didn't help him win any free kicks though.

If he doesn't want to play here then he may as well go because he was a complete liability today.

[Radford 72]

Didn't see four at the back until Scotland was sent off. Maybe we were supposed to be playing 4-4-2, but nobody told Andy Lawrie that, who sat directly opposite Sheerin all day, well... He may as well have been sitting. That's what I saw!
Sheerin was playing on the right of midfield in the first-half though! :shock:

It was clearly a back four we were playing.

[SaintSam1884]

The only liability on that park today was Andy Lawrie who is a bombscare at best.

[SaintSam1884]

Didn't see four at the back until Scotland was sent off. Maybe we were supposed to be playing 4-4-2, but nobody told Andy Lawrie that, who sat directly opposite Sheerin all day, well... He may as well have been sitting. That's what I saw!
Sheerin was playing on the right of midfield in the first-half though! :shock:

It was clearly a back four we were playing.

I must be totally blind then. If we were playing as you say we were, then Coyle should come in for even more criticism than I initially thought.

[Mr Spoons]

Radford's right. It was a back 4 we were playing and this took our best player - Stanic - out of his most effective position - wing back. Without him pushing forward as often as he normally does we seemed totally devoid of any creativity.

[dave mc]

Started with my 11 picked earlier on this thread,but in 4-4-2.Don't like 3-5-2,but thought OC might have changed to this at some point,just to get more width into the team.Very disappointed with our mid-field,too one paced to hurt anyone,really emphasises how much me need genuine pace,mobility and width.Must do better!!,but early days i know.Can't see anything in Lawrie's make-up to make it obvious he's any better than Stevo,but there appears a lack of real penetration through-out the team.,

[Watty]

Christ i am just pickin myself up from the floor, did someone say a few posts back that Steven Anderson should start a game for Saints, crikey surely we aren't that bad are we??

Hamilton came for a point and got it, we lacked invention, creativity, guile, pace and a cutting edge. And yet the width of a post stopped us from snatching an (undesrved?) win.

We seem incapable of breaking teams down and like in previous seasons the 2 home draws against teams we should be beating is an ominous sign. Its certainly been our achilles heal.

Desparado need to add a couple of new faces prior to the end of the window otherwise we will find Gretna out of sight by Xmas. Get Lawrie horsed and Mensing back to right back/wing back. Sheridan possibly played his worst game in a Saints shirt today, lost possession alot, set peices mince (why are we persisiting with these pointless floaty corner/free kicks??).

Not a happy bunny after that lacklustre pish, why can't we play at a bit of a higher tempo?

A note on Jasons sending off, was deserved yeh, he was getting a fair bit of treatment from the accies defence and midfield, so in a sense he was provoked into doing it through frustration. But surely he's got to realise that he'll have to put up with this all season long, with his World Cup jaunt and the coverage he got on the back of it he's even more a marked man and defo a target for the kickers (of whom there are many in this division).

Anyway, i seem to of raised alot of questions, feck knows the answers, but out of ten todays performance merited a 2, at best, Pish.

[Radford 72]

Ok, time to put a positive spin on this...

Did Halliwell have a tricky save to make?

Then...

Did Jason force the 'keeper into a great save from a one-on-one?
Did the 'keeper make another great save from Savo from a well-worked free-kick?
Did we have a goal chalked off for offside, which looked questionable?
Did Hardie have the worst miss in the world?
Did we hit the post?
Did it take a last man block to prevent Jason bursting the net?

I think if we'd scored just one of those chances today, the comments on here would be very different. If we'd scored two or three, we'd be delighted.

We were rubbish but still, in the main, dominated and should have won. The problems from last season are still there, it was another easy to predict result on the Prediction League.

We need a player with the ability to move at pace with the ball from the middle of the park. Hopefully he'll arrive this week.

[Dev]

We need a player with the ability to move at pace with the ball from the middle of the park. Hopefully he'll arrive this week.

I hope so too - I certainly don't think he's Derek Young anyway from what I've seen.

[Radford 72]

I hope so too - I certainly don't think he's Derek Young anyway from what I've seen.
It's taken him all of two weeks to be dragged down to our level!

[SJC]

Agreed that we had the chances to win that game, but theres not much point in saying if we'd have won that match we wouldn't be moaning- gives a bit of hope to the situation though.

I think the ref had already blown for a foul on the keeper before Hardies missed sitter, the ref definately didn't signal a goal kick anyway.

[Watty]

Ok, time to put a positive spin on this...

Did Halliwell have a tricky save to make?

Then...

Did Jason force the 'keeper into a great save from a one-on-one?
Did the 'keeper make another great save from Savo from a well-worked free-kick?
Did we have a goal chalked off for offside, which looked questionable?
Did Hardie have the worst miss in the world?
Did we hit the post?
Did it take a last man block to prevent Jason bursting the net?

I think if we'd scored just one of those chances today, the comments on here would be very different. If we'd scored two or three, we'd be delighted.

We were rubbish but still, in the main, dominated and should have won. The problems from last season are still there, it was another easy to predict result on the Prediction League.

We need a player with the ability to move at pace with the ball from the middle of the park. Hopefully he'll arrive this week.

3 league games, one goal scored, none conceded, doesn't take a rocket scientist to fidgure out our big prob eh?

Maybe just so pished off cos i am jus back from the game and its galling to see us fall off the pace in the league table already, 3 points next week please, please, please. Lets get this season on track!!

[Sonny]

If we continue to play like that every week, then the season will be over long before it has really begun. I will echo some of Sam1884's comments:

1. From what i've seen, Lawrie doesn't fit into this squad. Like Sam mentioned, Stevenson would be a better candidate. He may be the only player who can "naturally" play in that position, but he needs to get a bit of go about him. He does nothing, he contributes nothing. However, I feel Coyle will be apprehensive to drop him on the basis that he's a new recruit and he may need time to adjust. I think it's only fair we give him a few more games, but we need to see something from him.

2. We would work better with a change of style; we are supposedly an attack minded team, yet we are playing with two defensive midfielders in the middle of the park (I don't even believe Simon is suitable as a DM), and a lifeless right winger. For me, Sheerin is at his best when he compliments a strong, attack minded midfield. With things the way they are, he is the sole provider, something which he doesn't respond well to.

3. I really wish he'd change the formation. We changed it today, but still seem to revert every other week. I know a change might lessen Stanic's involvement, but can he not play Left Mid? It appears as though Coyle's trying to build the team around the formation instead of trying to build the formation around the team. It's like he's trying to cram every player who should be considered a starter into the first XI, and the only way he can achieve it is through a 3-5-2! :roll:

Nonetheless, I feel the potential is definitely there. Coyle just needs to discover what WORKS (not what accomodates) and stick with it.

[SaintSam1884]

Of course the comments on here would have been different if we'd scored two or three because to do that, you must do something right in the game. You can fluke one goal playing like that but not three.

A good side would have turned us over in every game we've played so far this season, and I'm not sure that when we do eventually meet a better side than Clyde, Queens, Hamilton and the cup pish we've faced, we'll raise our game and win those matches.

Our team has potential to be so much better but there are a few things hampering us fulfilling that potential and I believe that one of those is Coyles persistence with the liability Lawrie and Mensing and Sheridan sharing the same role in midfield. One or the other, and the removal of Lawrie. We have gotten worse in midfield, most notably on the right. Time for Stevenson to come back?

[Watty]

Time for Stevenson to come back?

No, No please, he has had three seasons worth of chances.....Mensing back on the right is my preferred option.

Hope this is not a season to far for Shez, has struggled in both league games at McD this season, hopefully he'll prove me wrong :?:

[Saint Hayley]

well dont really know what to say about this game. There was some good football played the day but yet again we couldnt get the goal needed. was the goal offside?

Andy was by far the worst player on the feild the day oweny should off taken him off he couldn't do anything the day or in other games for that matter, but as stated before he is the only player that natuarly plays that possison, I would rather start stevo than lawrie or maybe even ando for that matter......jessus did i just say ando :shock: Darren sheridan was.....well, hopeless is the only way i can put it but it wasnt his wost.

Moving onto the jason incident, Yes he was geting his shirt pulled through out the 90minutes but there was nae need for the elbow in the face, so yes he did deserve the sending off but some o the hamilton players deserved yellows.

We need to improve for next week and start geting points cause come on even Plastic Whistle are daying better than us............something is not right!

[SaintSam1884]

Agreed that we had the chances to win that game, but theres not much point in saying if we'd have won that match we wouldn't be moaning- gives a bit of hope to the situation though.

I think the ref had already blown for a foul on the keeper before Hardies missed sitter, the ref definately didn't signal a goal kick anyway.

Yeah - the referee had blown for a foul on the keeper before Hardie missed that chance, it would never have counted so is completely irrelevant.

Three games played, five points out of a possible 9, Gretna have taken 9 from 9. We've drawn two, won one and scored only one goal. I don't care that we've conceded none, it's not a positive when you're not scoring yourself and dropping points in a league that will run away from you if you're not careful.

[Radford 72]

One or the other, and the removal of Lawrie. We have gotten worse in midfield, most notably on the right. Time for Stevenson to come back?
LAWRIE WAS PLAYING IN DEFENCE!

[SJC]

I don't think we've improved from last season at all, we've probably gone back the way with Lawrie in there and Mensing pushed into a midfield role.

Young didn't do anything today when he was on the park, looks to have settled into the 'Saints Midfielder' role, meaning he did bugger all.

Was John Robertson the right back when Billy Stark was in charge? Almost exactly the same type of player as Lawrie is.

The discipline problem is still evident as well, 2 completely unnecessary red cards in the week.

We've got to get it right against Ross County next week, who have had a poor start to the season, if it's more of the same then we'll be too far behind Gretna already in the first bloody month of the season.

[SaintSam1884]

Time for Stevenson to come back?

No, No please, he has had three seasons worth of chances.....Mensing back on the right is my preferred option.

Hope this is not a season to far for Shez, has struggled in both league games at McD this season, hopefully he'll prove me wrong :?:

Mensing, Anderson or Stevenson are all better options than Lawrie.

Stevenson has always struck me as a player who doesn't have a natural position but can play a couple and do alright. To have someone playing on the right and "doing alright" would be better than having to watch the joke that is Andy Lawrie.

I'm starting to get sick of the sound of my own voice actually but come on, he really can't do anything, and he's actually getting an easy time of it with the fans. I've seen many a player treated far more harshly when they've been having games like he had today. I don't think there's any apparent reason for him to play so badly other than the fact that he is just poor.

[SaintSam1884]

One or the other, and the removal of Lawrie. We have gotten worse in midfield, most notably on the right. Time for Stevenson to come back?
LAWRIE WAS PLAYING IN DEFENCE!

You know that today was the exception rather than the rule - we will normally play 3-5-2, and Lawrie will normally play on the right of midfield, where he has been poor every time I've seen him. Stop being a complete knob.

[SJC]

The style of play seems to be to punt the ball over the oppositions defence to try and win a corner. Then Kevin 'Heid the Baw' James is our biggest goal threat.

The balls not been passed into our own half while we are in possession since Mark Reiley was last seen in a Saints shirt. :shock:

[Radford 72]

One or the other, and the removal of Lawrie. We have gotten worse in midfield, most notably on the right. Time for Stevenson to come back?
LAWRIE WAS PLAYING IN DEFENCE!
You know that today was the exception rather than the rule - we will normally play 3-5-2, and Lawrie will normally play on the right of midfield, where he has been poor every time I've seen him. Stop being a complete knob.
You have come on here and started laying into players (after having a go at some fans for doing so in the last few weeks) but thought Sheerin was playing "opposite" Lawrie and Stanic was at centre-back!

When you can't even recognise how we are playing and come out with comments like "not getting" Martin Hardie, no wonder people are "knobs" to you.

The treatment some players get on this forum is a disgrace.

[SJC]

If Sheerin played as badly as Lawrie did then he wouldn't get out of McDiarmid alive!

I noticed he was constantly going to the touchline at the end of the second half, and refused to head the ball- I hope he didn't have double vision or something like that because he needed to sniff some smelling salts at least twice near the end.

Anderson played well when he came on, and actually managed a run at the Hamilton defence.

[SaintSam1884]

One or the other, and the removal of Lawrie. We have gotten worse in midfield, most notably on the right. Time for Stevenson to come back?
LAWRIE WAS PLAYING IN DEFENCE!
You know that today was the exception rather than the rule - we will normally play 3-5-2, and Lawrie will normally play on the right of midfield, where he has been poor every time I've seen him. Stop being a complete knob.
You have come on here and started laying into players (after having a go at some fans for doing so in the last few weeks) but thought Sheerin was playing "opposite" Lawrie and Stanic was at centre-back!

When you can't even recognise how we are playing and come out with comments like "not getting" Martin Hardie, no wonder people are "knobs" to you.

The treatment some players get on this forum is a disgrace.

Well done, Kev. Very subtle.

The only player I've laid in to is Andy Lawrie and you're just pissed off because you like to take on a case and try to convince fans to give said player a chance, so you can feel good about yourself when he comes good.

I don't understand what Martin Hardie adds to the team, I invited anyone, yourself included to tell me what it is, but no you didn't bother. You just decided to be a dick, but then... I'm not really surprised.

Andy Lawrie played a lot further forward than Goran Stanic today, which made it an easy mistake to make.

[Shnoddy]

I think our problem is that were far to defensive and OC keeps on playing his favourites and not the strongest possible team.

[SJC]

The fans should have given Michael Moore a chance as well eh?

Lawrie is garbage, simple as that.

[SaintSam1884]

The fans should have given Michael Moore a chance as well eh?

Lawrie is garbage, simple as that.

I also remember Michael Moore being a case of Radfords.

I got on the backs of some people after the Clyde game because the negativity wasn't merited. It was one game in, and we didn't play that badly. We're now three games in, with only one win and two draws at home with only one goal scored. The team was negative, the start has been negative, you can't expect glowing positivity from people.

[Dev]

It's amazing how a poor performance by Saints can make everyone so frustrated and aggressive. This thread is just pure frustration at the moment and perhaps we'd be better leaving our thoughts until tomorrow morning when things have settled down a bit. It's not just Sam and Radford either, I ended up in a silly argument with the guy behind me just after Scotland was sent off simply because I was so frustrated with the team. So let's just chill a bit!

[Radford 72]

It's amazing how a poor performance by Saints can make everyone so frustrated and aggressive. This thread is just pure frustration at the moment and perhaps we'd be better leaving our thoughts until tomorrow morning when things have settled down a bit. It's not just Sam and Radford either, I ended up in a silly argument with the guy behind me just after Scotland was sent off simply because I was so frustrated with the team. So let's just chill a bit!
What have I said! I'm not the one throwing insults about (for a change!). I'm merely fed up with folk offering nothing constructive on this forum.

[Sonny]

Did anyone else hear that?

[Skeeter]

Paul Sturrock used to throw what he referred to as "quarter to five" letters from Saints fans into the bin. Maybe folk need to calm down a bit and think before they post!
It was deeply frustrating today and yet again we failed to capitalise on our chances but, as had been mentioned, if we'd got the penalty (looked like a stonewaller to me), if Hardie have left Lawrie's shot alone, if Paul Sheerin's shot at the end hadn't come off the post...
It's not as if we didn't create chances today. Jellema had a couple of great saves, Hamilton's defence made numerous blocks and for the most part we coped well with Accies attacks (I thought Gilhaney was superb for them).

[HertsSaintee]

Weird game. No doubt we played poorly, but we created a few decent enough chances to win the game. Hamilton never really threatened, and for the second home league game in a row, we've dropped 2 points which is the frustrating thing.

I can't for the life of me understand this long ball out of defence game we're playing - it's getting boring and isn't working. Why can't the manager realise that we have players who can actually play when they get going? The best chance and indeed best move of the game was a lovely piece of passing play on the deck in from the left in the 2nd half which ended with Sheerin sclaffing a shot wide. Apart from that, it was long balls over the top that Scotland, if he could be arsed, managed to control and run at the keeper. Idiot in the extreme for his red card though. Doesn't matter how much you think you've been kicked and fouled in a game, you can't do that. Totally deserved. I think you could tell with the nature of the misses that we weren't going to score today...

The worrying things for me today were the formation and the balance of the side. 4-4-2 definitely doesn't work. Stanic needs play further forward, and has shown signs of linking up with Sheerin well lately. To be honest, a forward thinking left hand side is critical to us, as we don't have a right flank at the moment. Guess I'm not alone in suggesting that Lawrie needs to be dropped. Poor player after the 4 or 5 games I've seen. I thought he was meant to be an attacking full back? I've yet to see him beat, or even try to beat his man to the byline. Inavariably a hacked punt out of defence, but on the odd occassion he plays the forward ball, he never goes for the return. So we have a wing back that never crosses the half way line - Great stuff. Anderson needs a run in the side - he had a good game when he came on and played pretty well in midweek I felt.


Herts

[Maradona]

Price to get in Divided by Quality of football = Rip Off

Totaly Pish

[SaintSam1884]

THERE'S NOTHING CONSTRUCTIVE TO OFFER ABOUT ANDY LAWRIE.

What do you want me to say? He's good? He's not, so I won't. End of story as far as I'm concerned, I'm no longer interested in being spoken down to by you.

[Radford 72]

THERE'S NOTHING CONSTRUCTIVE TO OFFER ABOUT ANDY LAWRIE.

What do you want me to say? He's good? He's not, so I won't. End of story as far as I'm concerned, I'm no longer interested in being spoken down to by you.
What do you want me to say? Yes, we were playing 3-5-2? :***:

You've clearly taken a hissy fit because it's been proved you have no idea what formation we were playing! Like Dev says, chill pet!

[Dev]

I'm no longer interested in being spoken down to by you.

Like Dev says, chill pet!

Not sure that one's going to work! :***: :***:

[Maradona]

5 games gone not one good dispaly of football the most boaring crap I've ever seen. Coyle's tatics are not working, there's no heart in the team and we can't score it's not looking good.

Hamilton were a very poor side and we managed a 0-0 draw.

Not good enough and Saints are charging £16 to get in what a joke. :evil:

[mainstand]

The fans should have given Michael Moore a chance as well eh?

Lawrie is garbage, simple as that.

I also remember Michael Moore being a case of Radfords.

I got on the backs of some people after the Clyde game because the negativity wasn't merited. It was one game in, and we didn't play that badly. We're now three games in, with only one win and two draws at home with only one goal scored. The team was negative, the start has been negative, you can't expect glowing positivity from people.

The team was negative in your views but how many chances did we make and how many fine saves did their goalie make?? Yes we should be winning our home matches but if they weren't creating any chances and drawing 0-0 then you might be worried but not when chances are being created.

If we had had breaks Hamilton could easily have suffered a similar scoreline to the one at Gretna.

It's 3 games into teh season, we have played 5 matches in total and have won 3 and drawn 2, we have still to lose a goal in the league this season. Let's get off some of teh players backs and calm down!!!!!!!!

[Radford 72]

The team was negative in your views but how many chances did we make and how many fine saves did their goalie make?? Yes we should be winning our home matches but if they weren't creating any chances and drawing 0-0 then you might be worried but not when chances are being created.

If we had had breaks Hamilton could easily have suffered a similar scoreline to the one at Gretna.

It's 3 games into the season, we have played 5 matches in total and have won 3 and drawn 2, we have still to lose a goal in the league this season. Let's get off some of the players backs and calm down!!!!!!!!
Right on brother!

Always knew we were kindred spirits, MS!

It could easily have been 3-0 or 4-0 today!

[eddie malone]

Why the hell is Simon mensing in midfield?????

Why cant Andy Lawrie go past a player down the wing????

Why does Savo run all day but yet he achieves f all???????

What kind of system is OC really trying to play??????

And why o why does Peaso not start???????

[Dev]

It's 3 games into the season, we have played 5 matches in total and have won 3 and drawn 2, we have still to lose a goal in the league this season. Let's get off some of the players backs and calm down!!!!!!!!

Three games gone, only one goal scored. Relegation form in terms of scoring.

As always you can make statistics say whatever you want them to.

[templeofsaints]

We should have won today if we'd taken our chances but too often there was no movement off the ball or willingness to push forward. I couldn't give a toss about formations if they are getting results but it's the basic teamwork that's missing from this side.

I'll do the pluses first - Hardie had a good game and both him, James and Mensing are showing some fight. We made enough chances to win the game comfortably and you could argue that luck wasn't with us today but at the same time if we have to rely on luck in this league we'll be mid-table at best.

Now the problems.....First of all there are too many passengers in the side. For me Lawrie is one of the worst players I've seen in a Saints jersey in ages (and sorry Kev, but he did not "Play in defence" today unless your definition of the word "play" is to stand about like a total tube while the opposition players run all round you and you have to take players out of position to cover for your mistakes). The guy has had his chances and should be dropped - I'd take Mensing, Anderson or even Stevenson over him in the side just now. Lawrie simply contributes nothing, is too slow and has all the ball skills of a one-legged Peter Fyhr.

Secondly Sheridan - he give a lot but I think age is catching up with him - too many rash tackles and his set piece delivery is, what's the phrase.....oh yeah TOTAL FECKING PISH. Let's punt the ball up to James and watch him head it over the fecking bar for the umpteenth bloody time :evil:

Even allowing for Scotlands sending off (deserved but maybe if the ref had punished the guys kicking him about the park earlier he wouldn't have retaliated) Saints were out of ideas. There was some good play on the park (the freekick that almost came off for Savo was excellent), but we aren't killing teams off and the service the strikers are getting is abysmal at times. How often did someone get to the byeline today to cut the ball back - give you a clue it was a lot less than the number of times the ball was hoofed from defence in the vague hope that the blonde streaks of pish in the Accies defence would make a mistake and let us in for a shot.

It's only taken 3 games but I'm losing faith rapidly now. Coyle has had all summer to come up with ball players and yet the stuff on the park is the exact opposite these days.

[Mr Spoons]

Okay, we didn't play as well as we could today - but on chances created we could - on a lucky day - have won by 2 or 3 goals. We havn't lost a game yet. Andy Lawrie hasn't played a good game for us yet - but that doesn't make him a bad player. Yet. We still, in my opinion are a creative central midfielder away from having the best squad in the division.

I also think we should give Hamilton credit for playing out of their skins today. Agreed, that kind of football isnae going to win many friends but they won't be at the bottom of the table if they show that kind of commitment all season - and their stand in goalie had a blinder too.

No need to press the panic button and start fighting amongst ourselves yet!

[templeofsaints]

Andy Lawrie hasn't played a good game for us yet - but that doesn't make him a bad player. Yet.

Perhaps not but at the same time it shouldn't mean he gets a guaranteed starting jersey when the likes of Anderson had a decent game midweek against Raith.

We still, in my opinion are a creative central midfielder away from having the best squad in the division.

I also think we should give Hamilton credit for playing out of their skins today. Agreed, that kind of football isnae going to win many friends but they won't be at the bottom of the table if they show that kind of commitment all season - and their stand in goalie had a blinder too.

No need to press the panic button and start fighting amongst ourselves yet!

I honestly didn't think Accies were that good - they worked hard and defended well but rarely threatened (although any minor threat they did have was obviously magnified by some of the incompetent defending on our part). Take away Gilhaney and most of their danger is gone.

[Broggy Man]

Really it is all about finishing. We wernt great to day but created enough quality chances to win three matches. im not going to get on Scotlands back for going down in the box under the lightest of challanges or Mad mental martin for his sky rocket from two yards or savo for hi glaring panick shot at one of the sweetest training ground free kicks ive seen from Saints for years. But the game died in the second half today and that has to be down to the coaching staff to change things around when we wernt looking like scoring. Imworried at the loss of mcmanus as he looks to be a decent enough stopper and not much passes him but when he went off why did OC not change the set up. in stead he brought Anderson on who performed weel enough for more of the same.

I would have thought the way the game was going it would have been better at that stage to bring a third striker on and go to three at the back which would have forced Hamilton back a bit. It seems that Saints are always negetive when it comes to theses decisions for gods sake we have been saying since last season draws killed our promotion hopes so are we looking at another oh well nearly season without taking chances.

And for gods sake OC get a midfielder who can pass the ball and create. If Darren Young is the answer play him if not get somebody in that can do the job. All respect to mad mental and scrappy but they are not creative midfielders.

[Mr Spoons]

Seems to me that until we can get our hands on a playmaker in midfield - and that's not going to be easy - we must persist with the 3-5-2 formation because it frees up Stanic to get forward. Temple's match report noted Stanic was below par. Of course he was - he's a wing back not a full back. I can't see why Mensing or Anderson didn't make up the back three today.

[perthandproud]

Agree with Broggy Man, i was sitting there half way through the 2nd half thinking that we really needed to change things around and not just with the players on the park but the formation they were playing, not sure if this is a go at Coyle or not wasnt JC as bad for not changing things around.
Wasnt it Jimmy Calderwood at Dunfermline that ended up putting an extra 3 attackers on against us and ended up getting a draw? Thats what i call a change in formation.

[Radford 72]

Wasnt it Jimmy Calderwood at Dunfermline that ended up putting an extra 3 attackers on against us and ended up getting a draw? Thats what i call a change in formation.
In a Cup tie at EEP, we were leading 2-0 at half-time through goals from Russell and Lowndes then Calderwood changed to a 2-4-4 formation and they won 3-2.

I do agree whilst OC deserves credit for getting the tactics spot on last week, they maybe weren't right today.

[perthandproud]

Just because he didnt get the formation right today, doesnt make him a bad manager, but i hope he will learn that you can and are allowed to change the formation, however saying that he could have changed it and we could have ended up losing. He is fairly new at this management game and will hopefully learn from what doesnt work, and i dont mean players.

[gc7969]

Fortunately, it seems due to work, I missed this match. However, the same themes keep appearing after every match, - no pace, no guile, no clue, no support.

The squad we have "on paper" should be capable of better. If they are not performing, why do they play? Remember Sturrock took the advice from a Mr Ferguson - if they won't play the way you want, say goodbye to them.

Against Clyde we played some good football on the ground, passing around and moving. When we show that worked, we resorted to the punt to the diddy men.

The culprits at this club have not changed and the changes are needed behind the scenes. If the coaches cannot see that Sheridan has gone, Mensing/Sheridan cannot play together, the lack of width and pace, which strikers work together, why are they with us?

Geoff Brown wants the fans back but how many returned today after the Clyde match? The product on the pitch has to bring the fans in at the prices charged.

The season is not over yet but Colye has to address the continuing problems. The players brought in against the players he has released is in my opinion, in the negative bracket.

[Saint Hayley]

Time for Stevenson to come back?

No, No please, he has had three seasons worth of chances.....Mensing back on the right is my preferred option.

Hope this is not a season to far for Shez, has struggled in both league games at McD this season, hopefully he'll prove me wrong :?:

Mensing, Anderson or Stevenson are all better options than Lawrie.

Stevenson has always struck me as a player who doesn't have a natural position but can play a couple and do alright. To have someone playing on the right and "doing alright" would be better than having to watch the joke that is Andy Lawrie.

I'm starting to get sick of the sound of my own voice actually but come on, he really can't do anything, and he's actually getting an easy time of it with the fans. I've seen many a player treated far more harshly when they've been having games like he had today. I don't think there's any apparent reason for him to play so badly other than the fact that he is just poor.

couldnt agree more I recon OC should drop lawrie for tuesday night and play stevo in his place and see if things improve

[Mr Spoons]

Woah! Knee jerk reaction time here. By all means make changes on Tuesday night; but don't for a second think that one players good performance against Elgin proves anything conclusivly in terms of the season ahead.

Patience.

[Hazel1884]

Well, having just read this thread there is a few over reactions here!

I thought Mensing, James and Hardie played well together, and Bryn took a few baws well - although his kicking really needs to be looked at! :wink:

Bad points? Referee failing to get a grip on the Hamilton players who took such a good grip of Jason Scotland's jersey, Sheridan was woeful today and we need to learn to get the ball on the deck a lot more!

I think Lawrie is your classic J-Ro - was he not travelling for the first season playing terribly and rightly got a hounding by the fans until he stayed in Perth and had a great season becoming one of the first names on the team sheet? He has not convinced me yet, but OC has shown him that there is nothing to threaten his position. Hold me back, but i am about to say play Stevenson - and i am Stevenson's biggest critic as i think he is honking, but at least he has a bit of drive about him and will have to compete to keep Lawrie out the team - unlike last seaosn he was the only player we had who could play on the right.

Again, Oweny could be said to sticking to his pals (Lawrie, Sheridan.....etc etc) too often. But we'll soon see and i fully expect around 4/5 changes (whether it be forced or through choice!) for the game on Tuesday against Elgin!

We played OK, but failed to finish them off with the chances we created.

[mainstand]

couldnt agree more I recon OC should drop lawrie for tuesday night and play stevo in his place and see if things improve

Why should he give Stevenson a chance again. He did nothing during the week and got sent off.

I think Tuesday would be an ideal game to try and get lawrie's confidence up by playing him.

[MUZZ]

today was shit. only positive thing is we are undeafeted. coyle needs to get mensing back in defence, get young in the middle, get andy jackson and peaso more involved, kick jasons arse(too lazy and greedy) and drop him he don't change. we look like we have no tactics when we go out on the pitch this season

[Radford 72]

Why should he give Stevenson a chance again. He did nothing during the week and got sent off.

I think Tuesday would be an ideal game to try and get lawrie's confidence up by playing him.
Agree!

I love this "give Stevenson or Anderson" a chance stuff? How long have they been here? Have they not had a chance and were they not identified as weak links last season? If they merit a chance, give them it but they shouldn't just get a run because a player is going through a settling in period.

CIS Cup on Tuesday so I expect us to field a pretty strong side to ensure we are in the hat for the next round. With a couple of bigger seeds falling, we could find ourselves seeded for the third round and with our luck would get a good draw!

[SaintSam1884]

For every John Robertson, there is a Michael Moore, Hazel. Some players can play poorly when they are at a club where they are not happy, or if they are travelling long distances to work every week, or if they don't get on with the manager and then come good at another club, or if they move house, or if the club they play for gets a new manager. Some players are just hopeless though and many Falkirk fans have said Lawrie has never been the same since the injury.

The fact that Andy Lawrie has come here, with 100% of the managers faith and been given a guaranteed start every week and then done nothing... Is very disappointing and sends alarm bells ringing in my head. I have allowed for the obvious time of Coyle giving the guy a chance but now it's becoming obvious that he's a hindrance and needs to be replaced so we're not so poor down the right anymore.

Anyone who cannot see the threat having Jason Scotland in our team poses to the opposition must be blind. I think Coyle made another mistake in fielding Peaso in place of Milne. I'd have put Jackson on.

[templeofsaints]

Why should he give Stevenson a chance again. He did nothing during the week and got sent off.

I think Tuesday would be an ideal game to try and get lawrie's confidence up by playing him.
Agree!

I love this "give Stevenson or Anderson" a chance stuff? How long have they been here? Have they not had a chance and were they not identified as weak links last season? If they merit a chance, give them it but they shouldn't just get a run because a player is going through a settling in period.

CIS Cup on Tuesday so I expect us to field a pretty strong side to ensure we are in the hat for the next round. With a couple of bigger seeds falling, we could find ourselves seeded for the third round and with our luck would get a good draw!

Anderson played ok last Tuesday against Raith who I'd say are a stronger team than Elgin :wink:

He's not the best player we have on our books but right now he's a million times better than Lawrie - he can actually move more than 3yds with the bloody ball for a start.

And I disagree about this settling-in period crap - that's the sort of shitty excuse we got from Stark/Clark etc (the team needs to gel). They had pre-season for that and if by now Lawrie still can't anticipate a pass from a teammate or find a blue shirt then he's a liability in the side - let him settle in at training before he starts for the first team.

[templeofsaints]

The fact that Andy Lawrie has come here, with 100% of the managers faith and been given a guaranteed start every week and then done nothing... Is very disappointing and sends alarm bells ringing in my head. I have allowed for the obvious time of Coyle giving the guy a chance but now it's becoming obvious that he's a hindrance and needs to be replaced so we're not so poor down the right anymore.

Hmm - Mark Campbell......deja vu :?: :roll:

[SaintSam1884]

It's not just the fact that Lawrie displays no ability to get back and defend or get forward and attack, the guy can't even make simple passes. On so many occasions he lost the ball today. He doesn't even show hints of potential to justify the faith a few have in him. Stone me! I don't believe Owen can't see how much he held back our side today, more than any other individual. He must be blind.

[Radford 72]

Yeah, Ando did do ok on Tuesday but Stevenson, who many are calling for to play has stated his desire to play in a more central role and has played there throughout the pre-season. He hasn't been involved at wing-back once.

Coyle will live or die by his decisions and he clearly thinks Lawrie has something, such was his glowing praise on signing him and the fact he's been a first pick and was one of the "stars" rested on Tuesday. If Hardie hadn't got in the way of his shot today and he'd done the right thing against Clyde we'd be looking at a player who had score two winners at home! He's not been great but some of the flack he's receiving is unreal. Comments like the fans aren't being hard enough on him beggar belief! :shock:

Remember Mensing at the start of last season? Woeful and look at him now. We have to trust Coyle to make a decision like he did with Campbell if Lawrie isn't good enough.

[Radford 72]

It's not just the fact that Lawrie displays no ability to get back and defend or get forward and attack, the guy can't even make simple passes. On so many occasions he lost the ball today. He doesn't even show hints of potential to justify the faith a few have in him. Stone me! I don't believe Owen can't see how much he held back our side today, more than any other individual. He must be blind.
Has he run over your cat or something? Don't you think he must possess something to have won two titles with Falkirk?

[SaintSam1884]

It's not just the fact that Lawrie displays no ability to get back and defend or get forward and attack, the guy can't even make simple passes. On so many occasions he lost the ball today. He doesn't even show hints of potential to justify the faith a few have in him. Stone me! I don't believe Owen can't see how much he held back our side today, more than any other individual. He must be blind.
Has he run over your cat or something? Don't you think he must possess something to have won two titles with Falkirk?

Did Mark Campbell not play for Falkirk?

He obviously possessed something then that he doesn't possess anymore. If he proves me wrong then great for him, and great for you. At the moment, he's anything but great for the team.

[templeofsaints]

If Hardie hadn't got in the way of his shot today

....the ball was going wide. :!:

[MUZZ]

lawries not a bad player. remember mensing looked shit early on last season. he'll be fine

[Radford 72]

Did Mark Campbell not play for Falkirk?

He obviously possessed something then that he doesn't possess anymore. If he proves me wrong then great for him, and great for you. At the moment, he's anything but great for the team.
Campbell only played until December and the infamous passport incident. They signed an ageing Alan Kernaghan to replace him and indeed Yogi played himself alongside KJ instead of him.

Lawrie on the other hand was almost ever-present and his form at the start of 2002/03 before John Potter broke his leg was tremendous.

I couldn't care less if it's good for me or not what Andy Lawrie does, I just don't enjoy reading page upon page of a guy getting crucified after four competitive games for the club!

....the ball was going wide. :!:
That's not important! :P

[mainstand]

It's not just the fact that Lawrie displays no ability to get back and defend or get forward and attack, the guy can't even make simple passes. On so many occasions he lost the ball today. He doesn't even show hints of potential to justify the faith a few have in him. Stone me! I don't believe Owen can't see how much he held back our side today, more than any other individual. He must be blind.

Sam did he knock you back or something??? Your posts on Lawrie are like a rattle snake attackin it's prey! :?

[SaintSam1884]

It's not like it's unfounded criticism like MUZZ with Scotland, going around using the ever inventive "he's a prick" and such like nonsense. People are pointing out why he didn't play well today, what he did wrong, what he should be doing in that position. There's a big difference.

[Radford 72]

It's not like it's unfounded criticism like MUZZ with Scotland, going around using the ever inventive "he's a prick" and such like nonsense. People are pointing out why he didn't play well today, what he did wrong, what he should be doing in that position. There's a big difference.
You are forcing me to agree with Mainstand here. Fair enough if you think what you've said has been constructive. We will agree to disagree on that. I think if the roles were reversed you'd be hurt if you read Andy Lawrie writing the same about you as you've said about him!

[18SJHedgieFC84]

Its another story of 'We had lots of chances but just couldn't finish them'.

[Cagey]

Hamilton are poor , even worse than East Fife & Raith. If we can`t beat them then there is no hope for us. OC keeps on that we play a passing game but apart from a couple of times a game I have yet to see it. Why play Hardie wide leat & Sheerin in the middle as the only time Sheerin plays welll is left of midfield & linking with Goran.
Sheridan & Mensing in midfield is a big mistake & Stevo,Ando or Mensing would be far better at winggback or right back than Lawrie. The are no playmakers in midfield & Young seems to be catching the Saints disease of sitting behind the ball. We seem to be happy not to lose games rather than go out to win them.
At the end of last season if we were drawing near the end of the game we would have put 3 up front or pushed big Kev up front but today nothing probably because we were down to 10 men but I can`t help think we are too negative.

REMEMBER LAST SEASON. TOO MANY DRAWS ESPECIALLY AT HOME .

[Raindog]

Hello all...first post, first season ticket (36 years old, but was a shop manager for many years, not conducive to Saturdays off!) and I wish I could have something positive to say, but...

I honestly thought Accies were one of the poorest excuses for a football team I've seen in ages. take out the wee blond guy that took the p*ss out of us down the left, and they really had nothing to offer. I'd like to think that our complete inability to finish what were, realistically, very good chances will improve in weeks to come, we're not far off being a very good side, but already we're dropping the costly home points.

Took a barrowload of stick from my Jambo mates (I live in Edinburgh) when we signed Kevin James, but the 2 home games he's been my favourite by far. Savo's workrate is superb.

Anyway, I'm half cut and off to bed. On a brighter note, my Ross County supporting buddy was at their game today, reckoned Gretna were very average. Gotta take any positive just now !

[slf]

get a corner,get a free kick.its obvious whats going to happen.high ball for james to get again :evil: pi@@ess me off

[Broon]

I can't believe how much nonsense I have read on here today. We played well and made enough chances to win ten games. The strikers are off form, it happens. We will improve soon, just need to get an early goal in a home game to take the pressure off.

Scotland played well today- his best 'team' performance for us. He set up about 3 clear cut chances and made 2-3 for himself. He's an easy target because of his style - lay off him.

If we scored one of our chances it would have been hailed as a good performance.

There are two negatives though:

1. Lawrie is shite.
2. Coyle is too defensive in his team selection each week.

[Broggy Man]

I can't believe how much nonsense I have read on here today. We played well and made enough chances to win ten games. The strikers are off form, it happens. We will improve soon, just need to get an early goal in a home game to take the pressure off.

.
Spot on Broon


Scotland played well today- his best 'team' performance for us. He set up about 3 clear cut chances and made 2-3 for himself. He's an easy target because of his style - lay off him..

Again Correct he drove forward well and lost very little posession. Could have stayed on his feet a little more


There are two negatives though:

1. Lawrie is shite.
2. Coyle is too defensive in his team selection each week

I dont know about the Lawrie thing It maybe that the way we set up for example your second point that hinders Lawrie.
Coyle is very defensive in his setup I said it earlier. We were running the game when Mcmanus got injured. I thought he would have brought Peason on and dropped Mensing into a back three and gave Jason a bit of space to pick up the ball and run at them. It was clear for me anyway that they were struggling with jason and were double marking him that would have caused them more problems. We really do have to go for the jugular when we are dominating. The sign of a good team is the ability to change half way through a game and let the oposition worry.

[Nick]

Scotland played well today- his best 'team' performance for us. He set up about 3 clear cut chances and made 2-3 for himself. He's an easy target because of his style - lay off him..

He also cost us two very likely goals, when he went himself instead of squaring to Hardie and then Mensing who both had open goals to score into. Fair enough he made the oppertuity, but id rather someone getting the ball with an open goal, rather than someone who has 2 players and a keeper closing them down. IMO

[Broon]

Scotland played well today- his best 'team' performance for us. He set up about 3 clear cut chances and made 2-3 for himself. He's an easy target because of his style - lay off him..

He also cost us two very likely goals, when he went himself instead of squaring to Hardie and then Mensing who both had open goals to score into. Fair enough he made the oppertuity, but id rather someone getting the ball with an open goal, rather than someone who has 2 players and a keeper closing them down. IMO

Ok, so he cost us two very likely goals. If you use that logic so did Sheerin who couldn't finish from 4 yards, hardie twice couldn't finish from 4 and 10 yards, Savo couldn't keep himself onside for his 'goal' and couldn't finish from 6 yards. Also James cost us about 95 goals when he lost all ability to head the ball downwards and Coyle cost us about 300 goals a year because he continually picks a defensive team.

Utter nonsense - are you seriously telling me when your best striker is clean through on goal you actually expect him to pass? Look what Lawrie done against Clyde and got berated for it.

[blueheaven]

I think yesterday has to go down as the second game in a row where Coyle has made a huge mistake with his formation and tactics. I feel that we need to pick a system we're comfortable in and stick with it. I'm no fan of 3-5-2, but it seems to suit the players we have and it was in that formation that we looked our best last season, so I'm a bit baffled as to why it now seems to have been abandoned.

I strongly feel that the players we have are more than good enough, but this season there's been a lack of cohesion/organisation about the team that wasn't there last season. We've got more or less the same team, but many of them now seem less able to play with each other than they were before the summer. I think that perhaps Coyle is falling into the trap of changing things around for changes' sake, and as a result many of our midfielders often don't seem to know where they're meant to be or what they're meant to be doing. I think the solution isn't dropping Scapegoat A or Scapegoat B, but simply going back to basics and giving everyone a clearly defined role/position.

Having said all of the above though, I do have to admit that I'm rapidly losing patience with Lawrie. I still think he should get another couple of games to see if he'll improve, but right now there are probably three other players in the squad who I think would play more effectively at right wing-back: Stevenson, Mensing, and even Milne (in Milne's case, I'm increasingly annoyed by his lack of qualities as a striker, but really think that with his workrate and pace he could be more effective for us in a wide role where he can get up and down the entire length of the pitch for the whole game).

[Calypso Kid]

Wasn't at the game yesterday but by all accounts it was vomit-inducing stuff. The appeals for Anderson and Stevenson fills me with utter terror. Surely we haven't stooped this low. It seems we've taken a step back from last season which is worrying. I can't slate anybody because i've not been to any games this season but i'll draw some conclusions on tuesday night hopefully.

[Tranmere Saintee]

Another of these freak occurrences I actually agree with Broon!!

The only thing I would add is, can somebody please tell me what position Hardie was supposed to be playing yesterday - he was as bad again as last week and virtually never won a single ball in the air. I actually like the guy as an out and out midfielder, but have been completely unable to fathom out what he has supposed to be doing in the last two games.

[imported_Jamie_Beatson]

Any thoughts on the penalty and offside "goal" incidents? Looked to me that whoever it was that knocked the ball home was well onside - there was a man on the post+the keeper and maybe even another defender playing him on. Also looked a definite spot kick to me. Maybe thats the blue tinted specs though.

Thought we played some good stuff in patches and if it wasn't for their keeper making at least three or four excellent saves, and a disastrous miss by Sheerin at the end we'd easily have taken three points. We'll play worse than that and win later on in the season.

[Zimmerman]

Agree that the tactics were wrong and my main beel with owen is that he needs to learn when things are going wrong and when to change them. This has already been said, but the formation was not right and things should be changed soon. I got into the game late and struggled for a while to find a formation, if it was 4-4-2, its the first time iv seen a 4-4-2 without wingers.

However there was some good play and we finally played some good football through the middle of the park: something I have not seen in a while. However we were still not great, but the game should have been won. Hardie missed two great chances.

As much as it annoys me, Scotland is really starting to fustrate me. At times during this game he was good, holding the ball up and beating his man. However he does not put enough effort in and it has to be said that he is lazy, but still a good player. It is fair enough holding the ball up, but you have to be in possesion of the ball first. Too many times he just looked around when he should have been moving towards the ball. He should have sqaured the ball twice in the game for two simple goals, one for hardie and one for mensing. It was so fustrating to watch what should have been a simple goal: wasted. I still think scotland should be first choice, but it will be interesting to see someone new upfront when he is band,hopefully jackson. He should not get his place in the team so easy. The only disappointing thing was peaso did not look too hot, but to be fair he did not get much of an opportunity with ten men. Iv calmed down a bit now as I was well pissed off after the game. However if we can play like we did in patches in this game, we should score goals.

One final point, I think mensing was solid as a defensive midfielder and as much as I like sheridan, it could free up another position for an attacking player. Also thought the formation held stanic back and that lawrie will struggle this season if he is going to an attacking winger, he just can't beat a man and I also thought the wee light bulb that hamilton had on the wing totally took the piss out of him. This is all my own opinion.

[Cagey]

I am glad it is your own opinion Zman. would hate to think you were taking dictation.

It is a worry that Gretna can put 6 past Hamilton & Dundee 3 past Dundee & we can`t even score 1.

We have no midfield & time is running out so I can`t see many changes now.We are now short of Dobs,Scrabble,Fozzy,McCann & the guy now with QoS only to be replaced by Lawrie & McManus so how can we be better than last season ?.

[208saint]

Not going to moan this week, only going to congratulate those of you who have seen the light. Radford you must be living in a dark room with Andy Lawrie :***: :***: :***: If he's a defender why can't he tackle, why does he shit himself and wimp out of every challenge that he faces, if he's a wing back when will he get forward and provide some ammo for the front two? He's crap, he's taking up a shirt get him out of the team, there must be a youngster who is worth a punt in midweek.

Hardie didn't miss the chance from the six yard box, it was deflected over and before you ask, the goalkeeper placed the ball on the six yard line afterwards because that clown of a referee decided that Sheerin had fouled him when the original cross came in. :wink:

Keep the faith, Champions elect............................................. 2007/08

[dunblanemike]

I see the official site says Scotland was sent off against Queen of the South!!??

[Tranmere Saintee]

I see the official site says Scotland was sent off against Queen of the South!!??

Must have been written by a BBC reporter :***: