SaintSam1884

St.Johnstone vs Partick Thistle

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Think it's quite clear Tommy doesn't rate Brown to be honest. Papped him out on loan to a part time team in the division below when he's had a decent amount of first team experience anyway, only appeared in 1 squad since returning from loan and, by all accounts, did alright before being hooked at half time.

I'd be surprised if he's still here after the summer. Can't see the logic in him extending his deal even if he's offered one.

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To be consistently conceeding goals early in matches is surely not just down to bad luck? What is the problem? Are we not warming up properly? Are the players confused by the tactical instructions from the management? Whatever it is we need to get to the bottom of it asap. The St Johnstone1884 Twitter account recently posted a photo which showed that if we were basing the league table on first half performances, then we would be bottom of the league.Tommy Wright has been quoted many times stating how important the first goal is at our level, so he must realise how much of an uphill struggle we are giving ourselves by consistently losing these early goals.

Its by highlighted by many throughout the season, but again the lack of leadership and pace in the team was clear for all to see. Sure, we've been unlucky in the respect that our captain Dave MacKay is out for the season and that another of our leaders, Frazer Wright, was judged not to be capable of playing at this level by our management team anymore, however there was nobody last night who was willing to take control of the game. Macca used to be good for that, but worryingly he seems to have went into his shell. Others senior players like Steven Anderson, Murray Davidson and Liam Craig need to stand up and be counted and get us back playing the style of football this has served us so well these past few years.

In terms of pace in the team, its been an issue for a while now, but surely our management team has to be identifying players we can bring in in the summer who will not only improve us, but who will add more pace to the team. For as bad as we were last night, credit must go to Partick who played well and the thing that struck me the most was their movement and running off the ball, paticulalry from their midfield players. We just dont have that at the moment.

Can RanDOOM or Radders please post up the list of players who are out/still under contract for next season? At this moment in time, I think we are crying out for a dominant central defender in the Duberry/Wright mould. I would also be looking for a few midfielders who were able to add pace to the team and who are comfortable on the ball. Finally I think we require another option up front.

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Just from memory we have Anderson, Krachunov, Doyle, Brown, Thomson, Lappin and Craig out of contract this Summer. Fiaher will be leaving too.

Heard from a few people that Anderson is not going to sign a new contract. To be honest I dont think that is bad news for either party. From Anderson perspective what else can he do for Saints? He helped win us the cup and has been part of the team that has be so succesful for us in recent years. He has had his testimonial year. The only way is down.

 

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I have made it a policy not to post on the game thread until the next day because sometimes emotion can overtake logic.

Anyway, let me make a few objective points.

To start with, we are not making the top six. Get used to that now. This is not a knee jerk reaction to last nights game but careful appraisal of the last few performances. Last night was the low of lows in a nightmare few months. We were shocking. Confidence is non existent throughout the squad and more worrying is the pathetic tackling and work rate of the team. 

TW has to seriously look at his team selection. He has been too loyal to too many who have been dinning out on reputation for an age. Macca is needing a rest and Zippy is a pale shadow of the the player we seen before his injury. Craig is slow and his passing aimless. Even reliable Muzz looked out of sorts until the second half. I thought Spoony played in fits and starts but he is a lad who thrives on support both on and off the field and sadly he isn't getting either. The defense is under pressure from the get go and our wing backs don't seem to understand the system always being caught out and not where they are supposed to be which has our central defenders being dragged over to cover. We were lucky not to be down by 4 at half time last night.

Listening to Tommy with the BBC reporter who I have to say asked some pretty decent questions and addressed the booing and unrest from the stands brought home to me just how far we have fallen; asked about the baying fans Tom responded:

"Listen, they have had four good years.............I'm not going to get ..............." He caught himself realizing the hole was getting bigger. The point being here that even he is starting have doubts about our future path.

This is going to be a long hard few months ahead and frankly I can't say with any certainty that we will be in the Premier league next year.

 

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Not much I can add to what's already been said.  I'm not sure that was the worst performance of the season, I thought we were worse against Dundee at Dens a few weeks back, although last night came close.  We played some nice football in the first five minutes, but the early goal, again, just put a dampener on everything - players and fans heads went down.  No idea what the answer is as we have very little on the bench or further down the pecking order that can really change things.  I hope Tommy is right and things do improve, although this blip is starting to look more and more like a downward spiral.

I was thinking during the game about the thread on here just a couple of months back about whether this was the best ever Saints team.  No.

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Where to start? Back to front I suppose...

Mannus, Made some good saves to "keep us in it" at two down, from my view point both goals were very similar in shot and distance and I think Mannus was hindered by the defense not having a clue what to do and blocking his view for at least one of the goals. (6)

Scobbie, played some alright wing play going forward in the second half however was suspect at his actual job of defending on many occasions though ultimately got away with the most of it.  (5)

Shaughnessy, probably the better of our defenders yet lacks any command, managed the simple stuff however nothing to write home about. (6)

Anderson, Regressed into old school bomb scare Ando since Fraz Wright left and looks completely and utterly lost with the task in hand. He may be a club legend for obvious reasons but time to move on. I hate to say it but if the rumors are true that he is not signing a new contract I wont be overly disappointed, Scottish Championship football beckons for him. Though I'll probably get slatted for that opinion cause "Ando"! (4)

Fisher, Yes, looked lost and out of position at times especially the start of the game which in all likely hood contributed to the goals, can't really defend that. However he did pick up his game and like the past few games where we have been utter dross was actually one of the better players in blue. Excellent cross for Kane's goal, needs to be doing that far more often. The abuse he was getting was beyond embarrassing last night, I'll echo what has been mentioned about certain hysterical screams at points, shouting mince like "get him off the park" and "Dae sumfin" followed by a torrent of F***, F***, F*** all night really shows a level of understanding of the game. (6)

Wotherspoon, Our most threatening player as usual since MoH left, can't really think of any glaring errors he made off the top of my head but I'm sure the haters on here will soon point something out. Really should have been putting more balls into the box, though the entire team was guilty of this. Gave us one moment of entertainment whilst stuck at the corner flag taking the p1ss out of the defenders, unfortunately though ultimately lead to nothing. (6)

Davidson, Another formerly great player that has regressed beyond belief. Looks lost as to what to do without Millar in there with him and is just charging around like a headless chicken chucking himself into challenges. Will occasionally get a great tackle in there but nowhere near the player he used to be. (5)

Craig, Looked to be hiding a lot of the time and was given a few poor balls from Scobbie in the second half that he clearly didn't want so just passed it straight back to him. Made up the numbers, did nothing really. (5)

Swanson, Looked like a threat at times but as had been said earlier also looked to be trying too hard. He appeared to be blowing out his arse after about 30 minutes but at least that showed he was putting an effort in. About the only player willing to take a pop. Fitness needs work. (6)

Cummins, Looked fresh and pacey to begin with then took the ball round the keeper to miss after he had been quoted a few weeks back that he "wouldn't do that again". Head went down after that and contributed nothing. Substitution for Kane was a correct decision from the management. (4)

MacLean, Seriously lacking confidence. Tried holding up the ball as much as he could which lead to him playing the majority of the game with back to goal, no bad thing but had nobody making runs which made the tactic completely superfluous. Can't remember him having a shot at goal. (6)

Subs,

Kane, Took his goal well and made up a lot of ground. Some neat wee flicks that actually came of well at points. Absolutely must start next week ahead of Cummins. (7)

Thomson, 100% categorically, not ready for this level. Had the ball at his feet a grand total of five times and lost it five times seriously putting the defense under pressure. He does have some very raw pace and talent but needs far longer developing, which is a concern considering he's 20 years old. Again, I'm sure the pitch forks and torches will be out for me again on that one because of course he's the messiah! (4)

Sutton, Not even a footballer! Has no idea what he is doing and I'm pretty sure I could do a better job than him and I'm utter horse sh!te! (3)

 

 

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I agree about Thomson tbh. I think people are willing him to do well because he's come through our system, but he either isn't ready or isn't good enough. Hamilton game aside, where he got man of the match on the virtue of a couple of decent runs, I've not really seen anything that suggests he'll be any more than a Caddis-like figure at the club.

Not giving up on him - I hope he can make an impact - but I can't say I'm as convinced as others seem to be.

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Where to start? Back to front I suppose...

Mannus, Made some good saves to "keep us in it" at two down, from my view point both goals were very similar in shot and distance and I think Mannus was hindered by the defense not having a clue what to do and blocking his view for at least one of the goals. (6)

Scobbie, played some alright wing play going forward in the second half however was suspect at his actual job of defending on many occasions though ultimately got away with the most of it.  (5)

Shaughnessy, probably the better of our defenders yet lacks any command, managed the simple stuff however nothing to write home about. (6)

Anderson, Regressed into old school bomb scare Ando since Fraz Wright left and looks completely and utterly lost with the task in hand. He may be a club legend for obvious reasons but time to move on. I hate to say it but if the rumors are true that he is not signing a new contract I wont be overly disappointed, Scottish Championship football beckons for him. Though I'll probably get slatted for that opinion cause "Ando"! (4)

Fisher, Yes, looked lost and out of position at times especially the start of the game which in all likely hood contributed to the goals, can't really defend that. However he did pick up his game and like the past few games where we have been utter dross was actually one of the better players in blue. Excellent cross for Kane's goal, needs to be doing that far more often. The abuse he was getting was beyond embarrassing last night, I'll echo what has been mentioned about certain hysterical screams at points, shouting mince like "get him off the park" and "Dae sumfin" followed by a torrent of F***, F***, F*** all night really shows a level of understanding of the game. (6)

Wotherspoon, Our most threatening player as usual since MoH left, can't really think of any glaring errors he made off the top of my head but I'm sure the haters on here will soon point something out. Really should have been putting more balls into the box, though the entire team was guilty of this. Gave us one moment of entertainment whilst stuck at the corner flag taking the p1ss out of the defenders, unfortunately though ultimately lead to nothing. (6)

Davidson, Another formerly great player that has regressed beyond belief. Looks lost as to what to do without Millar in there with him and is just charging around like a headless chicken chucking himself into challenges. Will occasionally get a great tackle in there but nowhere near the player he used to be. (5)

Craig, Looked to be hiding a lot of the time and was given a few poor balls from Scobbie in the second half that he clearly didn't want so just passed it straight back to him. Made up the numbers, did nothing really. (5)

Swanson, Looked like a threat at times but as had been said earlier also looked to be trying too hard. He appeared to be blowing out his arse after about 30 minutes but at least that showed he was putting an effort in. About the only player willing to take a pop. Fitness needs work. (6)

Cummins, Looked fresh and pacey to begin with then took the ball round the keeper to miss after he had been quoted a few weeks back that he "wouldn't do that again". Head went down after that and contributed nothing. Substitution for Kane was a correct decision from the management. (4)

MacLean, Seriously lacking confidence. Tried holding up the ball as much as he could which lead to him playing the majority of the game with back to goal, no bad thing but had nobody making runs which made the tactic completely superfluous. Can't remember him having a shot at goal. (6)

Subs,

Kane, Took his goal well and made up a lot of ground. Some neat wee flicks that actually came of well at points. Absolutely must start next week ahead of Cummins. (7)

Thomson, 100% categorically, not ready for this level. Had the ball at his feet a grand total of five times and lost it five times seriously putting the defense under pressure. He does have some very raw pace and talent but needs far longer developing, which is a concern considering he's 20 years old. Again, I'm sure the pitch forks and torches will be out for me again on that one because of course he's the messiah! (4)

Sutton, Not even a footballer! Has no idea what he is doing and I'm pretty sure I could do a better job than him and I'm utter horse sh!te! (3)

 

 

I agree with your very last line

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I think that's extremely harsh on Sutton. We don't play to his strengths. To score 34 goals in 76 games for Motherwell shows he does have talent.

 

15 minute cameo appearances is not helping player or club.

Too be fair to him then, he's no longer a footballer! 

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I think that's extremely harsh on Sutton. We don't play to his strengths. To score 34 goals in 76 games for Motherwell shows he does have talent.

 

15 minute cameo appearances is not helping player or club.

I agree to an extent. I think we're just not a great fit for him. He feeds off balls into the box and that's not omething we provide with a great deal of frequency. When he comes on, we're invariably chasing the game and we launch long balls at him. He's not a great target man. He's tall, but his strength is his goalscoring ability in the box.

Graham isn't as good a player as Sutton - or their respective records suggest that - but he was a much better fit for us.

Edited by Kyle

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Guest ScottMann

At this moment in time, I think we are crying out for a dominant central defender in the Duberry/Wright mould.

Didn't we just sign one?

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I agree about Thomson tbh. I think people are willing him to do well because he's come through our system, but he either isn't ready or isn't good enough. Hamilton game aside, where he got man of the match on the virtue of a couple of decent runs, I've not really seen anything that suggests he'll be any more than a Caddis-like figure at the club.

Not giving up on him - I hope he can make an impact - but I can't say I'm as convinced as others seem to be.

Thomsons barely 18 months younger than Caddis. When you compare him to other young players in this league hes absolutely miles behind them. Hes got an ability to beat men once or twice but hes still light years behind Spoony and Swanson

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