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Shibbydoo

Scum v Saints 16th Sept 2017

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Cummins wasn't good at all, the fact folk are claiming he is just highlights how poor we actually were. He made one good run in the lead up to the first penalty, and spent the rest of the time failing to win headers. 

  Cummins was the most effective forward on the park for us today and at least rumbled up their defence.

Agree that the display of others were not that good Johnstone was winning aerial battles and getting flick on's but MacLean was nowhere near to benefit - he should at this stage of his career be a penalty box player.

It seems to be a failing of ours that we do not perform well against bottom 6 teams - is this down to the management?

Maybe we give them too much respect instead of getting in their faces.

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  Cummins was the most effective forward on the park for us today and at least rumbled up their defence.

Agree that the display of others were not that good Johnstone was winning aerial battles and getting flick on's but MacLean was nowhere near to benefit - he should at this stage of his career be a penalty box player.

It seems to be a failing of ours that we do not perform well against bottom 6 teams - is this down to the management?

Maybe we give them too much respect instead of getting in their faces.

It can only be the fault of the management, it happens far too often for it to be anything else. We seemed to approach this game with an arrogance our performances didn't actually warrant. 

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Cummins put their defence under pressure and unsettled a very poor Dundee defence, thought Johnstone did more than Macca who wasn't at it, every flick on Johnstone made Macca was elsewhere. 

As above two full backs are a worry, and surely time for Comrie to be given a chance as Foster was dire. 

The centre of midfield is a worry too, not much creativity, Paton works hard and had a decent game, but him and Liam are too slow together and don't really create much, thought Scougall was a centre mid and today the game was screaming out for someone to take control and create in the middle.

With O'Halloran getting battered by the Dees, we really look pedestrian and lets be honest Dundee were average, but with Mannus basically throwing the ball in the net we were playing catch up all game.

Also the ref was awful, substitution in the middle of Liam trying to take the pen was bizarre, good to see that arse Gartland get his marching orders, thought Tommy was going to knock him out on the way up to the dugouts at the beginning of the second half.

Not many get pass marks and need to up it after that today and 70 mins against Hibs.

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Thought Zippy was our best threat today. As for Foster, I'd say he's got 2 or 3 more games to significantly improve, otherwise Mr Comrie might be heading doon fae The Blue toon.

Don't think Comrie is there, as he played versus Celtic, looked like him sitting in the main stand with the other young players

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The centre of midfield is a worry too, not much creativity, Paton works hard and had a decent game, but him and Liam are too slow together and don't really create much, thought Scougall was a centre mid and today the game was screaming out for someone to take control and create in the middle.

Center midfield worries me, barring muzz we are very weak. Paton is decent cover however he certaily works better in the 4-2-3-1 we had been playing.

I maybe wrongly thought scougall was a center mid as well and a replacement for midge.

What is beginging to concern me a little is that, scougall, for our 'marquees' signing for whatever reason has not compleated 90mins for us.

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Scougall is a central player. Let's not blame him for being the poor sod who gets sacrificed after an hour regardless of performance, we have a player like that every season. He needs a chance in the position Wotherspoon has been playing in lately, I reckon. 

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Poor again . Gift from Mannus and after that Dundee were better. They looked stronger won all the 50/50 balls . Glad to get in just 1 down . 2nd half they were better till the crazy last 20. Anderson disallowed goal would like to see that again . Mikey well marked and then injured . Johnstone not overly effective, Cummins was better when he came on . Striker position is a worry,Macca sadly needs a runner to play off him . Johnstone and Cummins don,t look likely to score many for us . Hendry be worth a game and offers a different option . Good to see midge on the bench 

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It can only be the fault of the management, it happens far too often for it to be anything else. We seemed to approach this game with an arrogance our performances didn't actually warrant. 

Wtf are you talking about? Once those players cross the white line,it's down to them! Have you listened to anything TW says? He's the most honest manager going, and treats every team with respect, there's no complacency or arrogance in his vocabulary!

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Wtf are you talking about? Once those players cross the white line,it's down to them! Have you listened to anything TW says? He's the most honest manager going, and treats every team with respect, there's no complacency or arrogance in his vocabulary!

He's not honest at all in all his interviews, he regularly speaks pish on purpose. His "we won't be signing anyone", two days before signing someone, has happened in about three of the last transfer windows. He seems to be blaming the ref for yesterday aswell. 

Far be it from me to dare criticise him, but every single game we've played against struggling teams near the bottom in the past 12 months has seen us out fought. If it was once, maybe twice, I'd blame the players, but it's the managers job to get them in the right mindset, if he's aware they won't be, and he's plenty of experience of seeing them not be up for it, then it's his job to get them focused. The attitude of the team yesterday was almost identical to the 3-0 loss last year, the only difference was yesterday we got two penalties. 

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The basic facets of football are something you don't need to be the most talented of players to bring to the table, things like working hard and matching the aggression of opponents. Saints, again at Dens Park, were found to be wanting in that regard. Everyone should have realised that Dundee were going to play with a desperate energy yesterday but Saints weren't at it from the off. It falls on both the individuals but the men motivating them as well.

Dundee played the better football but it all stemmed back to getting the basics right, they won the right to play their football. They got their talented attackers on the ball in good areas by being brave, pushing the full backs high and once they got into their groove had the confidence to show the composure required to cause us problems.

Fortunate isn't the right word to describe our start but we have looked vulnerable at times and yesterday was probably coming. Wake-up call isn't the right term either but hopefully we can look at the desire Dundee showed yesterday and realise we need to try and bring that ourselves next week, as Accies undoubtedly will.

On the flip side, it's still been a very good to the season and that shouldn't be lost off one bad result.

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Things are bad when Random & Radford have a go.

The Hibs game the full backs pushed high as well which negates Mikey & Scougall. Surely if the full backs are pushing high guys with pace could get behind them.

I will get slaughtered for this but our problem is the striker. We have not signed a decent striker since Macca & this season he hasn't looked at it I think this is his last season but Tommy seems scared to try something different.

 

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Things are bad when Randoom has a go???  Really?  Every time we fail to win Randoom slates every player and the manager!  He loves having a go and spreading his doom and gloom everywhere.

 

Saints were poor yesterday and deserved nothing from the game.  We were second to every ball, our decision making wasn't good enough and we played 5-10 yards too deep.  Dundee we more up for the game than we were (something I blame the players for rather than the manager.  It was easily the worst we've played this season and was way below the level we've become accustomed to from this team.  The team selection and change of tactic probably contributed and Tommy takes responsibility for that obviously.

 

HOWEVER

We haven't become a bad team overnight.  Tommy hasn't become a bad manager overnight.  We will come back from this and go on to finish top 6 this season in my opinion.

Onwards and upwards.

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Guest ScottMann

When you strip away the selectiveness we haven't had a very good start to the season. We've had a decidedly mixed start. Like it or not our record this season is P9 W3 D2 L4 and we're out of two cup competitions after one round. We've had a couple of good results that are being allowed to mask poor performances in others. It's just Saints being Saints.

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Dundees penalty is absolutely laughable, a ****ing disgraceful decision which will just be blaséd over but if it happens to Celtic/Rangers get talked about for weeks. 

The disallowed goal is a total nothing aswell, both sets of defenders spent the whole game winning that type of header without giving away a free kick yet he disallows a goal for it. 

Strikes me as a ref who shat himself thinking he got the Cummins penalty wrong and not wanting it to be a game changing decision, so then went and wrongly made two game changing decisions. 

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Dundees penalty is absolutely laughable, a ****ing disgraceful decision which will just be blaséd over but if it happens to Celtic/Rangers get talked about for weeks. 

The disallowed goal is a total nothing aswell, both sets of defenders spent the whole game winning that type of header without giving away a free kick yet he disallows a goal for it. 

Strikes me as a ref who shat himself thinking he got the Cummins penalty wrong and not wanting it to be a game changing decision, so then went and wrongly made two game changing decisions. 

To para-phrase the ref was crap.

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Well....   Back to it next week.   Forget. Move on as supporters.   Seen it too many times...

Is that 4 defeats in our last 4 visits to Dens..... sooner they get a new stadium the better... We obviously are struggling to adapt to shitholes these days.

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Saints were awful, sluggish, lethargic, no fire,  Dundee had more energy and covered a lot more ground than Saints, that's why every loose ball went to them.

But still, at the end of the day it was two absolutely crap refereeing decisions that deprived us of at least one point..

 

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