George Grieve

Taxi for Tommy?

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Emotions clearly running high last night, hence this ridiculous thread 

Some people need to take a deep breath and relax - yes it’s been a grim few weeks, yes manager team selections and player performances have been woeful but for ffs, we've Just played Aberdeen, Celtic twice, Rangers and Hearts.

We weren’t expected to get anything from those game and although I’m not saying we should accept the crap we have seen recently or accept getting beat 5-0 and 6-0, there needs to be a bit of acceptance that the top 5 teams are stronger all at the same time than I can ever remember.

I can understand people losing their rag after such poor performances but we have a run of fixtures now that we should be looking to haul a decent points return 

of the next 6 games, the only one i feel we won’t get  anything from is Hibs away - , Motherwell St Mirren, Livi, killie and Thistle are all winnable games 

Keep calm everyone - this is a completely different league to what we have been used to over  the last 6 Seasons 

Celtic were terrific yesterday, so were  Rangers  when they played us, just need to suck it up  and hope TW  gets his team selection right for Motherwell 

im sure we’ll Be back to 4-4-2 

 

 

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Not convinced that Tommy will be able to get the best out of new more attack minded signings. However he deserves more time but i am sure the  Directors and most supporters will be hoping to see some decent football alongwith a few wins in the next couple of months.  If this does not happen i think we have every right to question our Managers future. By Saints standards/ financial resources he was well backed during the summer and i feel we have every right to expect a bit better. 

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Losing to Celtic and Rangers is almost certain these days, maybe less so Rangers...but the number of goals we've conceded is certainly a worry when we know both sides aren't in top form.

We have been very lucky that those teams below us are performing shockingly worse than us. With only 2 wins, 2 draws and 4 losses enough to see us in 8th place and still have the joined 2nd worst goal difference.

Right now we need to hope that Livi begin to see a real drop in form because we are in no type of position to be taking on Aberdeen or Rangers for 6th and 7th.

We need to focus on getting some wins together and hopefully creating a sizeable gap between us, Hamilton and Motherwell who are only a win away from taking our place.

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Gee, bit of knicker wetting after a 6-0 humping.

It was only a matter time before Celtic clicked into top gear, unfortunately it was against us.

The fact that Broonie was absent was to their advantage, as McGregor who filled his role recycled the ball quicker, instead of posing and never wasted a pass.

Followed Saints since the early fifties and seen it all.

WE SHALL RETURN.

Keep the faith.

C.o.y.s.

 

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Much as it pains me to say it that Celtic performance yesterday was probably their best game for 2 seasons. They have been pretty uninspiring all this season and for most of last season as well. We have just had 4 league games against possibly the four best teams come the end of the season. We did well against Aberdeen played reasonably well against Hearts and even against Rangers were ok in patches, even the second half against Celtic with ten men wasn’t a total disaster (the less said about the first half the better). It will be the next four games that will define how our season is going to go not the four just gone.

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52 minutes ago, ejksjfc said:

Much as it pains me to say it that Celtic performance yesterday was probably their best game for 2 seasons. They have been pretty uninspiring all this season and for most of last season as well. We have just had 4 league games against possibly the four best teams come the end of the season. We did well against Aberdeen played reasonably well against Hearts and even against Rangers were ok in patches, even the second half against Celtic with ten men wasn’t a total disaster (the less said about the first half the better). It will be the next four games that will define how our season is going to go not the four just gone.

Agree with what you say Eddie, but let’s not completely flower it up, we were rank yesterday and were pretty poor in the away games at hearts and sevco, the media love bigging up these teams, but unlike previous saints teams of last few seasons we look weak, disjointed  and lack leadership on the park, we must be great to play against and certainly made Celtic look like world beaters.

Tommy has turned it round before, and we will see where we are after the next four games, but let’s not believe we are going to walk these games unless there is a bit more fight and change in attitude from a lot of the players.

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14 hours ago, mad saints fan said:

Losing to Celtic and Rangers is almost certain these days, maybe less so Rangers...but the number of goals we've conceded is certainly a worry when we know both sides aren't in top form.

We have been very lucky that those teams below us are performing shockingly worse than us. With only 2 wins, 2 draws and 4 losses enough to see us in 8th place and still have the joined 2nd worst goal difference.

Right now we need to hope that Livi begin to see a real drop in form because we are in no type of position to be taking on Aberdeen or Rangers for 6th and 7th.

We need to focus on getting some wins together and hopefully creating a sizeable gap between us, Hamilton and Motherwell who are only a win away from taking our place.

Livi, Killie, Hearts, Motherwell, St Mirren, and Aberdeen have all taken points off them in the last few weeks.

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20 hours ago, callander saint said:

Not convinced that Tommy will be able to get the best out of new more attack minded signings. However he deserves more time but i am sure the  Directors and most supporters will be hoping to see some decent football alongwith a few wins in the next couple of months.  If this does not happen i think we have every right to question our Managers future. By Saints standards/ financial resources he was well backed during the summer and i feel we have every right to expect a bit better. 

As a Saints fan I always hope for better but wouldn't say I have a right to expect it. What would you say is a fair expectation level for Saints, because we're currently 8th in the Premier and I'd say that's not especially bad? And yes Tommy has been well backed by Saints standards, but by the standards of the bigger sides in the league we're still a relatively small club with small resources.

In my view Tommy is here for the long haul and it's inevitable we'll have good seasons and bad ones but for me the important thing is that we don't have a truly awful one that would see us relegated. Anything else I can handle, provided it always feels like the manager is trying to improve us. I actually think Tommy could possibly survive a relegation here though, depending on the context.

Hammerings from the Old Firm never bother me too much as these things will always happen from time to time (even in our terrific 98/99 season we took a 7-0 and a 4-0 from Rangers). If there's one thing that worries me more at the moment it's the transition away from being a solid, dependable, workmanlike side that was incredibly hard to beat, into something that feels a little more adventurous but perhaps isn't quite clicking yet (that's just based on the limited number of games I've seen so far). I know fans on here have long been calling for a more entertaining approach but personally I've never been sure that that's a good idea for Saints. Also I'm not 100% convinced Tommy will stick with it - but I guess we'll see what happens as the season progresses.

Just one other point: I really, really think we should have kept Chris Millar. And I still say Scougall would be a better option for us in Millar's position than any of our other midfielders.

 

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52 minutes ago, blueheaven said:

 

Just one other point: I really, really think we should have kept Chris Millar. And I still say Scougall would be a better option for us in Millar's position than any of our other midfielders.

 

Think wee Midge was getting on a bit and probably this season could have been too much for him at this level ,we will never know.As for  Scougall he looks a half decent player but to lightweight , he needs a few fish suppers to beef him up a bit .

 

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I'm not sure I buy this scougall is lightweight talk. I have not been the biggest fan but I always thought of him as 'scrappy' much like midge in many ways.

Maybe thats just a perception I have as when we for him I really saw him as a direct replacement for midge, not being stuck in the wing, or a number 9 or in the hole or whatever the kids are calling it now.

He is certainly worth a couple of games given the utterly surprising, to no one really, failure of the wotherspoon experiment.

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2 hours ago, rickardo said:

Think wee Midge was getting on a bit and probably this season could have been too much for him at this level ,we will never know.As for  Scougall he looks a half decent player but to lightweight , he needs a few fish suppers to beef him up a bit .

 

Last time I had a fish supper it was devoid of Beef.:wink:

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23 hours ago, rickardo said:

Think wee Midge was getting on a bit and probably this season could have been too much for him at this level ,we will never know.As for  Scougall he looks a half decent player but to lightweight , he needs a few fish suppers to beef him up a bit .

 

Possibly... I certainly wouldn't have been starting Millar every week this season, but I reckon he'd still have played enough to be worth keeping on for another season.

On Scougall - I wouldn't have said his build is that much different to Millar's? I keep seeing people saying he's too this or too that to play in that role, but what are the alternatives? It doesn't seem like anyone has stepped comfortably into that position since Millar left, so why not give the closest equivalent player we have an opportunity to give it a go? Of course it's probably all academic now as it appears to be highly unlikely we'll see him playing for us in any position now.

 

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What attributes is it that Scougall has that makes folk think he would be an effective holding midfielder?

He can pass the ball but does he have the discipline and positional knowledge to know what pass to make (or more importantly not make) in that area? The second a player gives away the ball in that part of the pitch, you are always likely to give up a chance; that's what made Morris and Millar so good, they didn't give the ball away.

There is also the defensive side of it, helping out the full back (badly missing in recent weeks, although not helped on Sunday by the man-for-man system the manager wanted to employ), cutting out a pass by being in the right position, making it hard for the opposition to make passes due to the same ability, and of course tackling; Millar was expert at winning the ball by staying on his feet, so he was then in a position to use the ball.

Folk are defending the guy by saying TW played him out of position when, in my eyes, an attacking midfield role in a three behind a lone striker should be something he was capable of. If he is only able to play as a "ten" then that's pretty inflexible and doesn't bode well for his ability to operate in a more defensive role.

I hoped Callachan was going to be this type of player but he doesn't look close to it. In fact, having watched the IRN-BRU Cup tie at Tannadice, the two members of the first team squad who look closest to that type of player are McCann and McClean but they obviously badly lack experience at the moment and it was a fair blow to not see them go out on loan.

We were absolutely spoilt with Morris and Millar and I realise these players aren't easy to find but it's a shame that the manager hasn't reckoned it's priority to try and find one.

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