An open letter to St Johnstone Chairman Steve Brown

[silver_blue]

won't be going to any games v Rangers ( or whatever they will be called) next season and probably for a few seasons after that. They should be relegated to div 3.

F T O F

While initially agreeing with the Div 3 thing I've thought about it. Is it fair on the teams in these leagues that for a year their leagues are a farce while the Newco is involved. Also got to feel for the teams relegated from Div 2 & Div 1 when Newco are winning Div 3 & Div 2 who miss their paydays. What makes business sense will come into play and they'll get back into the SPL. The chairmen won't cut of their collective beak to take the moral high ground. Morality and business don't go hand in hand so if you won't go back if they remain get down to a bookshop and find a new hobby.

Personally it's Saints I go to see. Whoever they are playing is just "them".

[Cagey]

While initially agreeing with the Div 3 thing I've thought about it. Is it fair on the teams in these leagues that for a year their leagues are a farce while the Newco is involved. Also got to feel for the teams relegated from Div 2 & Div 1 when Newco are winning Div 3 & Div 2 who miss their paydays. What makes business sense will come into play and they'll get back into the SPL. The chairmen won't cut of their collective beak to take the moral high ground. Morality and business don't go hand in hand so if you won't go back if they remain get down to a bookshop and find a new hobby.

Personally it's Saints I go to see. Whoever they are playing is just "them".

There is a lot in what you are saying & I think they will be allowed to join the SPL even though it is against the rules.If they are allowed then the penalties that were mentioned ie a ban on signing over 18s & a 2/3 year 10 points deduction MUST be the minimum imposed.

[mainstand]

Sunday Mail are saying that a new co would have no penalties next season as the SPL articles do not allow them to penalise a new co. In turn I think this could also mean that the transfer ban that the SFA have put in place would also be nul and void. Suspect this one won't be sorted at Hampden but in the court of sessin.

[mainstand]

There is a lot in what you are saying & I think they will be allowed to join the SPL even though it is against the rules.If they are allowed then the penalties that were mentioned ie a ban on signing over 18s & a 2/3 year 10 points deduction MUST be the minimum imposed.

Sunday Mail are saying that a new co would have no penalties next season as the SPL articles do not allow them to penalise a new co. In turn I think this could also mean that the transfer ban that the SFA have put in place would also be nul and void. Suspect this one won't be sorted at Hampden but in the court of session.

[john1962]

Sunday Mail are saying that a new co would have no penalties next season as the SPL articles do not allow them to penalise a new co. In turn I think this could also mean that the transfer ban that the SFA have put in place would also be nul and void. Suspect this one won't be sorted at Hampden but in the court of session.

You think the SPL have the balls to take Rangers to court if they win any appeals?. What I am picking up is that the only punishment they will have is the ten point penalty already imposed? If so the only hope is Uefa. Other countries have thrown teams out but we smack their wrists and bring in rules to stop others doing it.

Lets hope the taxman liquidates them.

[sixties saintee]

You think the SPL have the balls to take Rangers to court if they win any appeals?. What I am picking up is that the only punishment they will have is the ten point penalty already imposed? If so the only hope is Uefa. Other countries have thrown teams out but we smack their wrists and bring in rules to stop others doing it.

Lets hope the taxman liquidates them.

One off the news reports said on Friday HMRC had agreed to nothing, heres hoping

[pete1967]

Has anyone petitioned eufa on the legal side of this

Don't think unlike our spineless sPl lot will make exceptions to the rules

Can't remember third lanark Clydebank and Gretna forming Phoenix companies to stay in the league

When teams go into liquidation then that's the end of the road

I m glad that Saints fans are showing there disgust to blatant financial blackmailing from our sol bigwigs and our chairmen who are putting a team who come to Mcd 2 times a season more important than our own loyal fans

[dramtie]

Has anyone petitioned eufa on the legal side of this

Don't think unlike our spineless sPl lot will make exceptions to the rules

Can't remember third lanark Clydebank and Gretna forming Phoenix companies to stay in the league

When teams go into liquidation then that's the end of the road

I m glad that Saints fans are showing there disgust to blatant financial blackmailing from our sol bigwigs and our chairmen who are putting a team who come to Mcd 2 times a season more important than our own loyal fans

why dont you start one?

[Indicator]

The lawyers Paul McConville has unearthed a new company registred by the law firm Brodies in EDinburgh and now a new trading company born on the 4th May 2012, the new incorporated company is called:

RANGERS FC ACQUISITIONS LTD.

If this is the newco this is the name I will always call them.

http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2012/05/06/found-is-this-rangers-newco-incubator-company/

Or maybe?

RANGERS FC (dubious) ACQUISITIONS LTD.

[angussaint]

Rangers newco playing youngsters are in the relegation position come this time next season, what will SPL do then?

Probably re-structure the league & make a 14 or 16 team league. How much does 1 or 2 (depending what happens at the split) games at McD make for the club, surely the use of McD for the Jehovahs & concerts generates more money than RFC or whatever their going to call themselves brings to the club.

[pete1967]

why dont you start one?

Might well do that

Someone has started one on the rangers poll thread think there's nearly 7000 signatures

Unfortunately it's being addrrssed to the spl bigwigs

So you know how in awe of rangers they are

Don't think uefa will move the goalposts unlike the spl

but you never know

[john1962]

Might well do that

Someone has started one on the rangers poll thread think there's nearly 7000 signatures

Unfortunately it's being addrrssed to the spl bigwigs

So you know how in awe of rangers they are

Don't think uefa will move the goalposts unlike the spl

but you never know

I think Uefa are keeping an eye on this. They have their new financial fair play rules hanging about and will want people to know they are serious. We are a small country with little televsion impact so can deal with Rangers without annoying any of the big countries but also send a warning shot out.

[dramtie]

Might well do that

Someone has started one on the rangers poll thread think there's nearly 7000 signatures

Unfortunately it's being addrrssed to the spl bigwigs

So you know how in awe of rangers they are

Don't think uefa will move the goalposts unlike the spl

but you never know

Wow! 7000 signatures, thats amazing! Must have taken Eric the bigot ages to do all of them :laugh::laugh:

[Percy Johnston]

With apologies for duplicating some of the excellent points made in the "Your Thoughts - Newco entry etc" thread, here is the letter I sent last week to Steve Brown. It won't change his mind about capitulating to the mighty Rangers, of course, but he really should be worried when lifelong supporters like me and my family are walking away. And yes (as Johnnny Rotten said) "We mean it, maaaan".

28 April 2012

Dear Mr Brown

We've never met, nor would I expect you to know me. I'm one of the rank-and-file St Johnstone season ticket holders that turns up week after week to support my club.

I have watched Saints home and away - including two European trips - for 40 years and have held a season ticket for around 30 years. In the mid 1980s, when the club was at its lowest ebb and needed every penny it could get, I spent two weeks' take-home pay on becoming a shareholder.

Nowadays, my two children also attend matches and they have a season ticket of their own (not to mention the replica strips, posters etc that generate further income for the club). They are on the point of being 'converted for life', just as I was 40 years ago.

In short, Mr Brown, I am the supporter that every football club chairman dreams of having. Whilst following St Johnstone, I've been abused, bottled and chased by other 'fans'; I've had to endure vile sectarian chanting every time Celtic or Rangers come to town; my domestic calendar has been wrecked by midweek matches in Stranraer and bizarre kick-off times to meet TV demands.

Through it all, I have kept coming back - but now, enough is enough.

Should you vote for, or be complicit in, any arrangement which allows Rangers FC (or any sort of artificially-created 'successor club') to remain in the SPL in 2012-13, my children and I will never return to an SPL match, home or away.

You must be aware that there are hundreds of other supporters at St Johnstone who feel as strongly as this, and many thousands of others at clubs across Scotland.

Over 15 years and more, Rangers FC has behaved disgracefully and illegally. Not content with already being rich and powerful, they have cheated, manipulated and bullied smaller clubs like ours. In recent weeks, Rangers' appalling behaviour has been magnified by their complete lack of shame for their past crimes and by the nauseating sense of self-entitlement which they have shown.

Rangers simply must be punished appropriately for their misdeeds, and expulsion from the SPL must form a part of this punishment.

As a St Johnstone shareholder, I am well aware of the potential financial implications of an SPL without Rangers (though I believe these will prove considerably less severe in practice than has been predicted). But this isn't about money - as you yourself have said, St Johnstone FC could survive in a league without Rangers - it's about fair play, honesty and integrity.

The choices that you and other SPL Chairmen and SPL Board members have to make are choices between right and wrong. It has been notable that even Rangers' manager has agreed this week that a severe punishment such as expulsion would be "the right thing to do, morally".

If the SPL has become so dependent on one club that it cannot take the morally-correct decision and, rather, has to invent 'special treatments' to allow Rangers to remain members, then I cannot bring myself to return, ever.

Mr Brown, both you, and especially your father before you, are honourable men without whom our club would simply not exist in its current form. Your achievements for, and commitment to, St Johnstone have been simply outstanding.

So on 30 April and subsequently, you have a choice about what I will tell my children in years to come: it will be either "Steve Brown is the Chairman who sold the soul of his club by allowing cheats to prosper, and that's why we're not going back", or "Steve Brown is the Chairman who voted for the principles of truth and justice - that's what St Johnstone will always stand for, and that's why we will always support them".

Yours sincerely

[soulfulsaint]

Aberdeen Goalkeeper Speaks Out

" Jason Brown has told Scotland’s top-flight clubs to be brave today and not give Rangers any special consideration.

The outspoken Aberdeen keeper waded into the Ibrox argument as 11 SPL members prepare to meet at Hampden to decide on the Light Blues’ potential readmission into the league as a newco and any subsequent penalties.

"Jason Brown is the first high-profile player to have a serious say on the matter and insists clubs need to take a stance to revive the ailing SPL.

The Dons star believes the chance is there for his club and others to build a bright future with Rangers temporarily out of the way.

Motherwell have been the first to benefit and are guaranteed at least one lucrative home tie in both the Champions League and Europa League next term with Rangers not permitted to play on the continent.

Brown reckons the others could also cash-in over time and bring a constant stream of money in to begin the erosion of Old Firm dominance.

He said: “I don’t think they should be given any special dispensation. If they’ve broken the rules, they should be punished.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/football/spl/2012/05/07/aberdeen-goalkeeper-jason-brown-urges-spl-clubs-to-punish-rangers-help-revive-league-86908-23851010/

[Cagey]

Aberdeen Goalkeeper Speaks Out

" Jason Brown has told Scotland’s top-flight clubs to be brave today and not give Rangers any special consideration.

The outspoken Aberdeen keeper waded into the Ibrox argument as 11 SPL members prepare to meet at Hampden to decide on the Light Blues’ potential readmission into the league as a newco and any subsequent penalties.

"Jason Brown is the first high-profile player to have a serious say on the matter and insists clubs need to take a stance to revive the ailing SPL.

The Dons star believes the chance is there for his club and others to build a bright future with Rangers temporarily out of the way.

Motherwell have been the first to benefit and are guaranteed at least one lucrative home tie in both the Champions League and Europa League next term with Rangers not permitted to play on the continent.

Brown reckons the others could also cash-in over time and bring a constant stream of money in to begin the erosion of Old Firm dominance.

He said: “I don’t think they should be given any special dispensation. If they’ve broken the rules, they should be punished.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/football/spl/2012/05/07/aberdeen-goalkeeper-jason-brown-urges-spl-clubs-to-punish-rangers-help-revive-league-86908-23851010/

Good on him. Easy to see he is not Scottish & brought up brainwashed that OF are Scottish football. I assume he will not be playing in Scotland next season though.

[Edstar101]

Oh dear....Sandy Jardine's heavies will be paying him a visit

[soulfulsaint]

I agree with the sentiments Percy although my story is not exactly the same it has many similarities. I genuinley feel for Steve - he is in a hellishly difficult position. But like you I feel something important will die if the decsion is taken purely for business alone. Good on you for being true to your values. I will still follow Saints but with a heavier heart and will not attend matches invloving the newco team under any name.

[Cagey]

Think Steve will be at Hampden by now so a bit late.

[Edstar101]

I agree with the sentiments Percy although my story is not exactly the same it has many similarities. I genuinley feel for Steve - he is in a hellishly difficult position. But like you I feel something important will die if the decsion is taken purely for business alone. Good on you for being true to your values. I will still follow Saints but with a heavier heart and will not attend matches invloving the newco team under any name.

Yip, this is what we were discussing in the pub after the game yesterday and agreed that that is what we will likely do. My mate summed it up saying that he would not attend any 'rangers' game in the future and if the OF's money was so important, the club could gladly sit a Rangers fan in his season ticket seat in the East Stand when they visit.

I too feel for Steve....you feel that the various chairmen are in a lose-lose situation here. Although, in my opinion, the longer term damage to Scottish football will come from allowing a newco to stay in the SPL

[Broon]

I love how they refer to him as outspoken simply for having an opinion on a matter which will affect his own club. An opinion shared by most fans. Toilet paper rag.

[slf]

well said percy.i agree with you .unlike you though i am in a dilemma at the moment,when everything is settled i will decide wether to return or not.

[slf]

I love how they refer to him as outspoken simply for having an opinion on a matter which will affect his own club. An opinion shared by most fans. Toilet paper rag.

agreed

[Broon]

I don't agree that Steve Brown is in a difficult position. Football is a game of passion that would never survive without fans. Scottish Football is on its knees at the moment with only the die hard fans turning out week in week out. This decision threatens to lose 40% of those from the game (based on a conservative estimate from various fans polls). This is the easiest decsion in the world - Rangers out - fans in!!!

[Johnstoun]

I don't understand the big panic over the TV money. Since the OF hoover up the majority of the existing deal, removing one of them, changing the voting structure and having an equal split of the new, admittedly reduced, deal sees the only big loser being Celtic.

In the days before all their games were shown on Sky we would get 9,000+ for a game against the OF, now we rarely break 6,000. Get rid, promote Dundee and we've replaced the gate money, probably for a bigger game.