Abernethy Saint Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 Well if the SPL governance (or is that an oxymoron?) have decided that RFC will play in the SPL next season come what may - then the chairmen of all SPL clubs should vote against them playing. We then find out who is pulling the strings. I strongly suspect RFC WILL be in the SPL next season - I want to know WHO is deciding this and why. The only way that we can get any transparency around this will be if all the Chairmen say NO. Otherwise those pulling the strings and making the decision will hide behind the Chairmen. So dear SteveB - do you want to be taken for a mug by 'those behind the scenes' and end up a scapegoat and party to making Scottish football derided and the laughing stock of Europe - because that is the least shameful of the places we could end up being when this whole sorry saga comes it's likely close. Poor enough as the reputation of the Scottish league and game is these days, we can put up with much as long as we have our integrity and pride in place. We can lose that very easily - and it will be a very hard thing to get back. Well said. I think, though it works like this: chairmen vote against newco in SPL, that's it - their out. Chairmen vote for - that's fine, but there are all sorts of rules Rangers must still meet do this. Those are the rules that are being ignored.broken. Note that much of the debate has now passed, in the media, to what will happen after the chunts are allowed back in. You work it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henryhallsdanceband Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) chairmen vote against newco in SPL, that's it - their out. And so we might think - but in truth?...who knows. I'm ever more of a conspiratorial mind that there is a driving force behind keeping RFC (IA) in the SPL. I am not convinced that this 'driving force' is a group of club chairmen. Who is it that seems so determined to keep RFC in the SPL? If indeed there is a cadre of chairmen behind all this who is their commander-in-chief. SOMEONE has to be the main proponent for RFC survival in the SPL - make yourself know to us. MAN UP! Edited May 28, 2012 by henryhallsdanceband Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulfulsaint Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 Kudos to you for consistently putting forward arguments based on the actual facts and actual rules for explaining why Rangers will go under. But won't the SFA and SPL just keep changing or ignoring the rules? There was a quote from the Telegraph on here saying that the SPL licence rules are going to be ignored. And Doncaster went on record over the weekend to say, if (ie when) the SPL vote the newco back in, that will be done without additional sanctions because there are no more sanctions that can be imposed. The tide has already turned against that view - "STV can reveal Rangers <B> haven’t met</B> criteria to play in SPL next season, so an extension given has been given until June 15 to provide accounts. If thye don't meet that and its audited and credible then they haven't met the criteria. Feature is here: http://bit.ly/LXGDDy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john1962 Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 And so we might think - but in truth?...who knows. I'm ever more of a conspiratorial mind that there is a driving force behind keeping RFC (IA) in the SPL. I am not convinced that this 'driving force' is a group of club chairmen. Who is it that seems so determined to keep RFC in the SPL? If indeed there is a cadre of chairmen behind all this who is their commander-in-chief. SOMEONE has to be the main proponent for RFC survival in the SPL - make yourself know to us. MAN UP! I think that after Mark Daly's revelations last Wednesday that things have gone quiet, although apparently him and Jim Spence ripped Chick Young a new one on Saturday on Sportsound, and this has allowed the Ibrox propoganda machine to try to get things back to their agenda. However the evidence is still all there and will still have to be considered at the correct time. To paraphrase Soulful, the authorities have to play the long game to ensure that there can be no comeback. Keep the faith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henryhallsdanceband Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 You know Soulful - I'm just feeling very down and depressed for Scottish football by all of this, despite your words of reason, logic and fact. I am afraid to say that I am drifting into the AbSa camp of inevitability, and fear that we delude ourselves if we think that RFC will be anywhere but in the SPL next season. There may be 101 reasons, legal and moral, why perhaps they shouldn't be - but despite all that - they'll be there - and the rest of us will have to put up with the gloating that will emanate from the mouths of their spiteful acolytes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wish i was Joe McGurn Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 I think that after Mark Daly's revelations last Wednesday that things have gone quiet, although apparently him and Jim Spence ripped Chick Young a new one on Saturday on Sportsound, and this has allowed the Ibrox propoganda machine to try to get things back to their agenda. However the evidence is still all there and will still have to be considered at the correct time. To paraphrase Soulful, the authorities have to play the long game to ensure that there can be no comeback. Keep the faith And you can find that here http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/scotfoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john1962 Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 And you can find that here http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/scotfoot Cheers will give that a listen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john1962 Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) For anyone who hasn't seen it here is Billy Dodds telling the world Rangers weren't paying tax and that it was his salary and not a loan. Ghostie felt that everyone should get to laugh at it http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/i-refuse-to-believe-major-players-evaded-paying-millions-in-tax.17704904 Edited May 28, 2012 by john1962 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstar101 Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 For anyone who hasn't seen it here is Billy Dodds telling the world Rangers weren't paying tax and that it was his salary and not a loan. Ghostie felt that everyone should get to laugh at it http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/i-refuse-to-believe-major-players-evaded-paying-millions-in-tax.17704904 Thoroughly enjoyed reading, and laughing, at this. Em, why did Ghostie not post it himself?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevensan Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 So the nuclear information apparently involves the Graeme Souness EBT. Apparently he was paid a lot more than the 30,000 the BBC alleged last week... http://rangerstaxcase.wordpress.com/2012/05/24/thank-you-all-of-you/comment-page-53/#comment-101343 If I remember correctly he bought quite a few players from Ibrox while a manager in England. Obviously Tugay and Ferguson at Blackburn, but also $8 million for Boumsong while at Newcastle (and wasn't this the transfer that got HMRC investigating in the first place?) What else have they found, was it brought up in the closed door Big tax case tribunal and is that why the decision is taking so long? Is there serious money laundering in play here like I hinted yesterday on the Ibrox latest thread? Interestingly the poster of the Souness info ruled out match fixing, bank and political interference and bribery, but did not mention money laundering. What on earth have they been upto?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SingaporeSaint Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 Em, why did Ghostie not post it himself?? Get's his bitches to do it for him nowadays Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henryhallsdanceband Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 And you can find that here http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/scotfoot Had a listen to the programme last night - why was I irritated by Chick tP? Interesting listen though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henryhallsdanceband Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 For anyone who hasn't seen it here is Billy Dodds telling the world Rangers weren't paying tax and that it was his salary and not a loan. Ghostie felt that everyone should get to laugh at it http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/i-refuse-to-believe-major-players-evaded-paying-millions-in-tax.17704904 Splendid stuff Billy. So you never thought about asking, or at the end of the tax year checking your P60 to see, how much tax you actually paid on the payment you received through the EBT. Yes OK - you may say that it was paid for you - but it's still your tax payment to HMRC. I'd have thought that, as at the time you received the payment you clearly weren't told how much tax you had paid, then you might have been just a wee bit interested. No? - well maybe you get paid that much that the tax you pay doesn't matter. Oh but hold on - your tax affairs clearly do matter as you say... 'It's not that players are dodging tax, it's just that there are different avenues open to them to pay lower tax rates' Riiiiight. So no questions asked about your tax then Billy when you received the EBT payment. Does that make you complicit with tax avoidance? An individual is complicit in a crime if he/she is aware of its occurrence and has the ability to report the crime, but fails to do so. As such, the individual effectively allows criminals to carry out a crime despite possibly being able to stop them, either directly or by contacting the authorities, thus making the individual a de-facto accessory to the crime rather than an innocent bystander Good luck sir... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john1962 Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 Thoroughly enjoyed reading, and laughing, at this. Em, why did Ghostie not post it himself?? He is waiting on something explosive for his 10000 post. Had to credit him, he dug it out. I read the paper. Dodd's crayons were a bit smudgy though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstar101 Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 He is waiting on something explosive for his 10000 post. Had to credit him, he dug it out. I read the paper. Dodd's crayons were a bit smudgy though. He is such a drama queen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john1962 Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 Get's his bitches to do it for him nowadays You jealous cos you lost your place? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abernethy Saint Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 So the nuclear information apparently involves the Graeme Souness EBT. Apparently he was paid a lot more than the 30,000 the BBC alleged last week... http://rangerstaxcase.wordpress.com/2012/05/24/thank-you-all-of-you/comment-page-53/#comment-101343 If I remember correctly he bought quite a few players from Ibrox while a manager in England. Obviously Tugay and Ferguson at Blackburn, but also $8 million for Boumsong while at Newcastle (and wasn't this the transfer that got HMRC investigating in the first place?) What else have they found, was it brought up in the closed door Big tax case tribunal and is that why the decision is taking so long? Is there serious money laundering in play here like I hinted yesterday on the Ibrox latest thread? Interestingly the poster of the Souness info ruled out match fixing, bank and political interference and bribery, but did not mention money laundering. What on earth have they been upto?? Interesting, thank you, but top-league managers of English clubs allegedly taking bungs to put through high-value transfers is a bit old hat, isn't it? And even then, it would only have been legally (as opposed to morally) wrong if Souness hadn't declared the payments to HRMC if he should have done. AND as EBT's were not deemed inappropriate at the time, would even this be necessary? Bit of a shame it wasn't match fixing, etc. That really might have nailed it. See Juventis are in trouble again over this - be interesting to see if they are "abolished" - bet they aren't... I never understood why folk thought Redknapp had any chance of the England job - FAR too many skeletons in the cupboard ree tax, bungs, etc. I don't know how to send an e-mail" - yeh yeh yeh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueheaven Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 Bit of a shame it wasn't match fixing, etc. That really might have nailed it. See Juventis are in trouble again over this - be interesting to see if they are "abolished" - bet they aren't... What Rangers have done is far worse than match-fixing. It's cheating on a far larger scale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abernethy Saint Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 What Rangers have done is far worse than match-fixing. It's cheating on a far larger scale. Well, no it isn't, with respect, subject to more revelations. Match-fixing has always been more heavily punished in footy than complicated transgressions of complicated club and tax rules. With respect, for fairly obvious reasons. 1/ Long-term complicated tax fraud, allowing us to buy slightly better players who might win us more cups, all being equal. 2/ Give us a penalty, or I'll put a bulllet through you're child's brain. Note that in the recent Italy case, clubs like Juve were hammered, but got NOWHERE NEAR "abolition", "expulsion" etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blues Brother Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 Dizzy!!!!!!!! Cant keep up with it all now. Switched off over the last couple of days then a bomb goes off!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calypso Kid Posted May 29, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 This latest act of folly may in fact prove the last for them. This needs to be ended now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevensan Posted May 30, 2012 Report Share Posted May 30, 2012 Can any of the historians tell us what happened in 65 to the SFA and us when we took the SFA to court over a £25 fine relating to a testimonial. Think we are actually the only club that has ever done it. Ok, had a look into this one. From what I can understand, Saints took the SFA to court as the punishment had been handed down without even telling Saints they were taking action. There was no right of appeal, and no hearing. Saints further fought that the SFA rule not allowing you to take actions through the court was unfair. Lord Kilbrandon heard the case and ruled for Saints. It's very different from the Rangers case: 1) Rangers were given a hearing and an appeal 2) FIFA rules, which were not present in 1965, now dictate to the governing body (SFA) that if any member takes legal action then they are in breach of FIFA articles. THIS WAS NOT AN ARTICLE IN 1965. Full analysis here - http://bit.ly/L1wNio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wish i was Joe McGurn Posted May 30, 2012 Report Share Posted May 30, 2012 As it seems our associations are inept and in all honesty are unable to punish what has gone on I think its time we as football supporters collectively start complaining to FIFA to get them to take control over this and actually hand out the punishments that they can. This has gone long enough with threats of this and that and in truth its all crap. They are full of bluster handing out judgements without anything to back them up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Neutral Posted May 30, 2012 Report Share Posted May 30, 2012 As it seems our associations are inept and in all honesty are unable to punish what has gone on I think its time we as football supporters collectively start complaining to FIFA to get them to take control over this and actually hand out the punishments that they can. This has gone long enough with threats of this and that and in truth its all crap. They are full of bluster handing out judgements without anything to back them up. You want Fifa to take control???? They are the most corrupt organisation in football & open to the highest bidder! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevensan Posted May 30, 2012 Report Share Posted May 30, 2012 You want Fifa to take control???? They are the most corrupt organisation in football & open to the highest bidder! Well that won't be Rangers then... ***. Did you read their CVA proposal - its a real laugh. http://www.rangers.co.uk/staticFiles/c9/b3/0,,5~177097,00.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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