Lochwinnochsaintee Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/14426650.Football_clubs__forced_to_scrap_badges__under_ancient_law/ What a load of p!sh. Can't believe there are such busybodies around that would force clubs like ours to change their crests which have served their teams so well for many years. As if we have nothing better to spend our wads of cash on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave H Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 This has been ongoing for years... certainly seems if rules are being broken and the rules are unlikely to change we need a new badge... Seems trivial all the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havana Saint Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Headlines. Any decent lawyer would be able to defend the club with this. Good luck to anyone wishing to challenge St Johnstone for having the "Agnus Dei" in the badge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mizfit Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Well, in that case Lord Lyon can pay for my tattoo cover-up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cagey Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Wouldn't think it cost Saints all that much but very expensive for council taxpayers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sconesjfc Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Bring back the lamb! st.johns-son and rik2304 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garydavidson Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Bring back the lamb!Would there not be an issue with it as well since it has the St Andrews cross? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint-johns-toun Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Bring back the lamb??its never left ..It's slap bang in the centre of the crest sixties saintee, mike_gain, blueheaven and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueheaven Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Headlines. Any decent lawyer would be able to defend the club with this. Good luck to anyone wishing to challenge St Johnstone for having the "Agnus Dei" in the badge.Could always get around it by using the version from the 1996 Challenge Cup Final programme instead (it replaced the Agnus Dei with a drawing of a man pleasuring a sheep). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havana Saint Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Bring back the lamb!The agnus dei has the saltire in it. To challenge that would be to challenge fundamentals of Christian Churches across the country. Cannae see this as a story to worry about tbh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abernethy Saint Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 I wouldn't underestimate this story. Ayr United have been through this. The issue, which potentially affects many clubs, went to Westminster for decision as heraldry is apparently a reserved matter, but they have (apparently wrongly) bumped it in turn back to Edinburgh for decision by some t*** called the Lord Lyon or something equally ridiculous, and he is on record spouting mind-boggling archaic nonsense about the importance of "heraldic purity" etc. It's all as confusing as it is ridiculous. It's only a Scottish matter, as the law in the rest of the U.K. Is different - it falls under trademark and copyright law.Im actually quite embarrassed I know this! uphallsaint 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOODLUM65 Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 I wouldn't underestimate this story. Ayr United have been through this. The issue, which potentially affects many clubs, went to Westminster for decision as heraldry is apparently a reserved matter, but they have (apparently wrongly) bumped it in turn back to Edinburgh for decision by some t*** called the Lord Lyon or something equally ridiculous, and he is on record spouting mind-boggling archaic nonsense about the importance of "heraldic purity" etc. It's all as confusing as it is ridiculous. It's only a Scottish matter, as the law in the rest of the U.K. Is different - it falls under trademark and copyright law.Im actually quite embarrassed I know this! O.K. Your Lordship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomGuy Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 The agnus dei has the saltire in it. To challenge that would be to challenge fundamentals of Christian Churches across the country. Cannae see this as a story to worry about tbh.Thats not the point.If they demand we change our badge, then we have absolutely no choice in the matter. Airdrie and Ayr have both got thousands of signatures in separate petitions to try and save their badges and its not made a single bit of difference and they've both had to change. You get a year, then everything from letter headings to stadium signs have to remove the badge. Only positive is that they can only act on complaints, they cant just pick you up on it, so if nobody reports the club to them then it'll be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havana Saint Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Thats not the point.If they demand we change our badge, then we have absolutely no choice in the matter. Airdrie and Ayr have both got thousands of signatures in separate petitions to try and save their badges and its not made a single bit of difference and they've both had to change. You get a year, then everything from letter headings to stadium signs have to remove the badge. Only positive is that they can only act on complaints, they cant just pick you up on it, so if nobody reports the club to them then it'll be fine.I wasn't making a point, merely illustrating that our badge has a different aspect insofar as the agnus dei cannot be classified in the same way as say Airdrie or Ayr Utd. To do so would clear the pathways to challenge the Church of Scotland and The Roman Catholic Church. The Agnus Dei is a fundamental aspect of the illustration of the Lamb of God.If someone challenges us, Broon should email the Vatican straight away. That would solve it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slf Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Bring back the lamb!succulent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slf Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Ye need an easy design sjfc .All ye need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomGuy Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 (edited) I wasn't making a point, merely illustrating that our badge has a different aspect insofar as the agnus dei cannot be classified in the same way as say Airdrie or Ayr Utd. To do so would clear the pathways to challenge the Church of Scotland and The Roman Catholic Church. The Agnus Dei is a fundamental aspect of the illustration of the Lamb of God.If someone challenges us, Broon should email the Vatican straight away. That would solve it.Thats not the only problem with our badge though, plus the churches coat of arms are registered with the Lord Lyon due to their age Edited April 14, 2016 by RandomGuy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepless Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 I've got the damned thing tattooed on my arm. I'd like to see them change that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomGuy Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 FWIW the problems with our badge seems to be the use of letters (aye, really, although it seems to be one they care the least about as Airdrie were allowed to retain writing), the use of a shield, and the use of the cities coat of arms.We could fight it, and it costs £2,500 to apply to register the coat of arms, but we'd have no chance due to the amount of "breaches". I imagine we'd have absolutely no problem if we switched from the eagle to the sheep, but I don't think we could have it framed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomGuy Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 This is the Airdrie one that breached rules due to being inside a shield..And the new one which is free of any rule breaks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjfc99 Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 (edited) Saints have been aware of this since end of last year and have a version of the badge which has no Perth or 1884 on the shield. It does retain the lamb though. Edited April 14, 2016 by sjfc99 Havana Saint 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaggy Jenkins Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 This story raised its head about a year ago. I actually thought it was mentioned at the time we had officially registered it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint sid Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 there's a bit coming on bbc 1 just now about it, how about we change the badge to "F*CK YOU LORD LYON YA FUD" with a ram giving him one up his royal starfish? rickardo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HelsinkiSaintee Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 This would be quite an attractive design to have on the badge. Abernethy Saint and Jimmy Wallace 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garydavidson Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Could always get around it by using the version from the 1996 Challenge Cup Final programme instead (it replaced the Agnus Dei with a drawing of a man pleasuring a sheep). MySpazz and blueheaven 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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