David123

Player contracts and transfers

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My point was about the effectiveness or otherwise of Saints PR - an ongoing issue that's been talked about to death on here, as you know.  What anyone would want them to say about this situation is a bit of a moot point, but the facts at the moment are these:

1) A first team player has gone out on loan
2) That player is a striker, an area we are short of players in
3) Paying supporters WILL think, "ah that must mean a new signing"
4) The longer Saints leave it without clarifying intentions, the more frustrated supporters will become (and they are, on several websites), alienating them and potentially causing a drop in attendance at games.  Even coming out and saying they have no plans to sign anyone is better than silence.

PR - It's not really that complicated.

You are really suggesting the club should issue a statement saying they are looking for a striker? Really?

Tommy has said what his intentions are numerous times. The BBC article mentioned the reasons Kane went on loan along with Tommy's interview in the courier. It isn't the place of the club to come out and say anything. We aren't Hearts - Tommy is in charge of the squad.

 

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No. Supporters feeling alienated and let down by the club = drop in attendances.

Read the post.

Club comms can always be improved, but they've done a very good job over the summer in my opinion. I don't necessarily agree that they need to begin pandering to unjustified panic merchants at every opportunity.

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You are really suggesting the club should issue a statement saying they are looking for a striker? Really?

Tommy has said what his intentions are numerous times. The BBC article mentioned the reasons Kane went on loan along with Tommy's interview in the courier. It isn't the place of the club to come out and say anything. We aren't Hearts - Tommy is in charge of the squad.

 

I'm saying that Saints absolutely have a duty to clarify, if not set, the expectations of their paying supporters when a vulnerable area of the team is affected.  Any business selling anything that wants to maintain goodwill with it's paying public has the same duty if things change and leave a negative perception.  If particularly part-time fans don't think it's likely they'll see goals scored or Saints win as a result of a 1st team regular going on loan, that lack of communication is not exactly going to convince them otherwise - and there are those that are in full panic mode because of it.

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I'm saying that Saints absolutely have a duty to clarify, if not set, the expectations of their paying supporters when a vulnerable area of the team is affected.  Any business selling anything that wants to maintain goodwill with it's paying public has the same duty if things change and leave a negative perception.  If particularly part-time fans don't think it's likely they'll see goals scored or Saints win as a result of a 1st team regular going on loan, that lack of communication is not exactly going to convince them otherwise - and there are those that are in full panic mode because of it.

Are you serious? 

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Absolutely.  If you think that effectiveness of communication wouldn't affect the way would-be supporters feel about going to games, let's hear it.

Our manager has quotes in two papers today clarifying why Kane was loaned out, and what his plans are in terms of getting another player in.

What are you wanting? Him to start naming targets? 

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I'm not really sure what the club can say. Tommy has explained why Kane has left on loan, he's said constantly that he's after a striker. in some interviews, he's said he's after 2 players and that we've been speaking to potential signings. 

We've got 3 weeks until the window closes. Some potential targets have gone elsewhere, but lets be honest, none of them were THAT great anyway (Sammon, Storey and Graham managed about 10 goals between them last season) and others were never likely to come off anyway (May).

I would rather not be going into the first home league game with question marks over our striking options, but we've dealt with much worse odds before and been ok. If it gets to the last week of the window and there's radio silence about new players, I think that's the time to worry.

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Given the choice at the beginning of pre-season would you rather have had Sammon and Storey or Scougall and MOH? Cos I know what I'm happier with.

Personally I'm still confident we'll add another striker. I'm also confident we'll finish above Partick.

I think I would rather of had scougall and storey :laugh: with the potential of one in. MOH is only 6 months can't play v rangers didn't start in the cup and is maybe a few weeks behind fitness. That's already 4 games he has and wont start.

Scougall I think is behind in fitness too and both seem to be swapped for eachother? so having both is not helping us a great deal right now

I think we will add another striker too but all rumors have been exahsted it seems, unless the super secret world beater is still on.

Even then with Kane gone I think we need two unless we are going one up front. Which then rules out McLean to a certain extent and I'm sorry but we have to write zippy out compleatly.

Its probably pre season nerves but I am feeling twitchy that others seem better placed. Thistle whapped us midweek, Dundee looked sharp midweek from what I saw of motherwell they will cause us problems at the weekend.

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Club comms can always be improved, but they've done a very good job over the summer in my opinion. I don't necessarily agree that they need to begin pandering to unjustified panic merchants at every opportunity.

I think it is fair for fans to wonder what the plans are for the team. Slightly concerning that we are currently running with 2 strikers only one of which cannot play in some games.

Fair point that the club shouldn't say we are signing x or y player, but we seem to have heard murmurings of the club signing a striker for a few weeks now (something everyone recognises we need) yet instead, we let someone go out on loan.

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I'm saying that Saints absolutely have a duty to clarify, if not set, the expectations of their paying supporters when a vulnerable area of the team is affected.  Any business selling anything that wants to maintain goodwill with it's paying public has the same duty if things change and leave a negative perception.  If particularly part-time fans don't think it's likely they'll see goals scored or Saints win as a result of a 1st team regular going on loan, that lack of communication is not exactly going to convince them otherwise - and there are those that are in full panic mode because of it.

No they don't, they don't have to clarify anything to anyone (apart from HMRC), paying customer or not. It's a limited company not a plc. To seriously suggest that someone that had every intention of going to the game tomorrow, had planned their Saturday around it, and now is suddenly just going to say 'you know what, I'm not going now cause the club hasn't been crystal clear with every single iota of their transactions and contract negotiations, and I am now officially in the cream puff with them' is just ludicrous.

I can see what angle you may have initially been looking at with your OP but I think people have debated it to the point it was proven incorrect and you are now just digging your heals in.

As for those that are in full panic mode over this, they really need to take a look at what's truly important in life. If this sort of thing has them all worked up to the point they won't attend the game tomorrow I think they best go and sit in a cold dark room for a bit.

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No they don't, they don't have to clarify anything to anyone (apart from HMRC), paying customer or not. It's a limited company not a plc. To seriously suggest that someone that had every intention of going to the game tomorrow, had planned their Saturday around it, and now is suddenly just going to say 'you know what, I'm not going now cause the club hasn't been crystal clear with every single iota of their transactions and contract negotiations, and I am now officially in the cream puff with them' is just ludicrous.

I can see what angle you may have initially been looking at with your OP but I think people have debated it to the point it was proven incorrect and you are now just digging your heals in.

As for those that are in full panic mode over this, they really need to take a look at what's truly important in life. If this sort of thing has them all worked up to the point they won't attend the game tomorrow I think they best go and sit in a cold dark room for a bit.

Ok to avoid hair-splitting, I agree that Saints don't HAVE to tell anyone anything (apart from your afformentioned HMRC).  I'm thinking about it this way - as the owner of a business largely dependent on customers through the door, my reputation would be at risk if I didn't keep existing customers up do date with my intentions.  It's called PR.  It's even more crucial that I do this after changes to my business that may be perceived negatively - and absolutely neccessary if my customers have other options where to spend their money (in Saints case, going elsewhere on a Saturday afternoon, or saving their gate money for something else).  Nobody is saying that the current situation would make or break someone's attendance this coming Saturday - however, you can't deny PR has been a problem with the club for a while.

Anyhoo, we're kind of getting off topic...

 

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Ok to avoid hair-splitting, I agree that Saints don't HAVE to tell anyone anything (apart from your afformentioned HMRC).  I'm thinking about it this way - as the owner of a business largely dependent on customers through the door, my reputation would be at risk if I didn't keep existing customers up do date with my intentions.  It's called PR.  It's even more crucial that I do this after changes to my business that may be perceived negatively - and absolutely neccessary if my customers have other options where to spend their money (in Saints case, going elsewhere on a Saturday afternoon, or saving their gate money for something else).  Nobody is saying that the current situation would make or break someone's attendance this coming Saturday - however, you can't deny PR has been a problem with the club for a while.

Anyhoo, we're kind of getting off topic...

 

Or on the flip side, PR team could have played an absolute blinder here. Think about it, on both WAP and Pie & Bovril this is the hottest (WAP) and second hottest (P&B) conversation on a Friday afternoon before a full card of football this weekend. Everyone is talking about it.

Now if the club then announced a 'Jewel' signing or even double signing this evening to go straight into the squad for tomorrow you may very well get quite a few more bums on seats.

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I think it is fair for fans to wonder what the plans are for the team. Slightly concerning that we are currently running with 2 strikers only one of which cannot play in some games.

Fair point that the club shouldn't say we are signing x or y player, but we seem to have heard murmurings of the club signing a striker for a few weeks now (something everyone recognises we need) yet instead, we let someone go out on loan.

But we know what the plans are for the team, Tommy has quite clearly stated a number of times throughout the summer in the press and in interviews with our own media that he's looking for one, maybe two, strikers to come in and that we are (and have been) in discussions with a number of options.

If that information isn't satisfactory, but you don't want them to come out and mention the names of these targets, exactly how specific would you expect them to be?

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:wink::wink::wink::wink::wink:All of this is doing my head in... I am sorry but I don't need to know what's happening behind the scenes regarding signings.. that's up to the chairman etc! I trust TW to let him know what's required! At the end of the day no one really knows what goes on behind closed doors! As it stands 2 players have moved on from their respective clubs, two who obviously are not merited good enough by their teams! That sounds like really good signings right enough.. all this hysteria before the league has hardly kicked off! No one is more passionate about their team than me but I don't see the need to go out & buy sub standard players just to placate supporters blood lust! 

We are back to budgets, and the lack of pulling power our team has which is the real crux of the problem.

1st priority is to avoid relegation, and is there really any need to bankrupt yourself to compete in this one horse race?

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But we know what the plans are for the team, Tommy has quite clearly stated a number of times throughout the summer in the press and in interviews with our own media that he's looking for one, maybe two, strikers to come in and that we are (and have been) in discussions with a number of options.

If that information isn't satisfactory, but you don't want them to come out and mention the names of these targets, exactly how specific would you expect them to be?

No, he shouldn't say we are signing a certain player, but as you say, he's been saying all summer that he wants one or two strikers. We've signed none and let one go out on loan.

If we have been in discussions and no one signed yet, then it suggests we've either missed out or for whatever reason it's just not happening. We've been linked with a few and I think Storey and Sammon are two Tommy would have been actively pursuing.

Would love to be wrong and we pull out s great signing, but gut feel is that we've missed out on those we have been chasing. That's the concern for me.

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He said this morning Kerr and Kane were loaned out to help sign someone else. 

Has there not been more go than come in. Shoorly we are not counting McClean & Henry as players in as they were for development squad.If you count them & left back it is 5.How many left ?.

We have also loaned out Hurst who Tommy listed as a squad player.

Can also see another couple of squad players being loaned(we have 3 out is there a limit ?.).

If they are being loaned out to save wages then we are in a sorry state. We got an extra £100k for every place we finished in top 6. We had a good Sevco crowd at end of season & surely we didn't lose out with Europa payment & crowd.

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