Hearts V St.Johnstone Tuesday 18th January

[Cagey]

25 minutes ago, Tricky6 said:

11 goals in 21 games….really tough to see how we aren’t winning games! 

Please Callum can you not try 4_4_2 just once to see if it improves things.

[garydavidson]

15 minutes ago, R.B.B:- Adz said:

Not sure I agree with O’Halloran just yet but May, Davidson and Craig need to go and some serious quality needs to be brought in. The fact that MacPherson, Butterfield and Ciftci were not only the three best players on the pitch for Saints tonight but also the three that showed the most effort / fight tell you everything that you need to know about the shitebaggery of this current squad compared to the years where Anderson, MacKay, MacLean, Wright, Easton and Millar ruled the roost. 

So you just washed Davidson and Craig out of Saints history?

[Shibbydoo]

6 hours ago, Cagey said:

Please Callum can you not try 4_4_2 just once to see if it improves things.

He won't

[ex-montrosesaintee]

Thought we looked significantly better last night but the first goal seemed to knock the stuffing out of us completely.  4 shots on goal, 3 from Ciftci that were decent efforts, and the usual dribbled mishit from May.  I'm sick of watching May jog about aimlessly, an absolute waste of a jersey just now. 

I still think we'll be OK though.

[Dav69]

30 minutes ago, montrosesaintee said:

Thought we looked significantly better last night but the first goal seemed to knock the stuffing out of us completely.  4 shots on goal, 3 from Ciftci that were decent efforts, and the usual dribbled mishit from May.  I'm sick of watching May jog about aimlessly, an absolute waste of a jersey just now. 

I still think we'll be OK though.

Well said , I thought I was the only one who sees that May can’t hit or pass a ball without it being a spongy powder puff squaf . As for the “ we will be alright “ but then NO . This squad at best is looking like finishing 3rd in Championship next season . 

[rik2304]

How many times are Saints players going to crash into each other this season?

 

[SaintJet]

37 minutes ago, montrosesaintee said:

Thought we looked significantly better last night but the first goal seemed to knock the stuffing out of us completely.  4 shots on goal, 3 from Ciftci that were decent efforts, and the usual dribbled mishit from May.  I'm sick of watching May jog about aimlessly, an absolute waste of a jersey just now. 

I still think we'll be OK though.

Eh?

[blueheaven]

I felt there were some small-ish signs of improvement in the first half last night, and we at least seemed to be trying to play a bit further up the park to get closer to the opposition goal. I'm not sure if that was a tactical plan or just the effect of having Ciftci on the pitch. MacPherson really stepped up and I honestly think there could be a player there. He has a bit of skill and pace and looked up for it. However, I felt Butterfield had a poor game by his previous standards and some of his dawdling around our own box was almost very costly on a couple of occasions.

Ciftci himself caused the opposition defence more issues than most of our other strikers combined have managed for the bulk of the season. He covered a lot more ground than I expected, he showed some really nice touches and he was actually willing to try shooting at goal. Still, he gave away the ball in the lead-up to the opposition scoring, so I assume we'll never see him again.

[SaintJet]

I'm starting to get that heavy feeling that we have had it. First half looked decent and I was thinking maybe we could get the win to change the course of the season but we just folded after the first goal and still have a lot of aimless disjointed play all over the park and no real threat and certainly no wide thread to bring our forwards in the game.

Are we really surprised? We have signed no one of significant calibre to change things for us despite it clear for everyone to see that we need change.               

I hear people saying that there is still a couple of weeks left in the 'window' ; No there isn't!  We have one week from today because make no mistake if we don't get a point  out of the Dundee game we can forget any chance we have getting anyone to come here who is any quality at all.

I don't know who is out there and what value they will command but we need to 'invest' £250,000 to £500,00 in player recruitment or our time in this league is over.

[John Bonham]

17 minutes ago, blueheaven said:

I felt there were some small-ish signs of improvement in the first half last night, and we at least seemed to be trying to play a bit further up the park to get closer to the opposition goal. I'm not sure if that was a tactical plan or just the effect of having Ciftci on the pitch. MacPherson really stepped up and I honestly think there could be a player there. He has a bit of skill and pace and looked up for it. However, I felt Butterfield had a poor game by his previous standards and some of his dawdling around our own box was almost very costly on a couple of occasions.

Ciftci himself caused the opposition defence more issues than most of our other strikers combined have managed for the bulk of the season. He covered a lot more ground than I expected, he showed some really nice touches and he was actually willing to try shooting at goal. Still, he gave away the ball in the lead-up to the opposition scoring, so I assume we'll never see him again.

I think that’s a really fair assessment ( putting aside the wee cifti dig, he wont be dropped  )

I thought Macpherson really drove us forward from midfield and was our motm. He clearly has a bit of skill about him too with the way he took the ball out of the air and left the 2 hearts players for dead. Can he bring that every week is the next question. 
 

agree Butterfield caught out a few times. He’s been class since he came in though so hopefully just a blip. 
 

cifti is going to be great to watch. He was doing a lot of talking throughout the game too which I liked to see. Once he’s fully sharp he’ll be a real asset. 
 

 

Edited January 19, 2022 by John Bonham

[Smarmy Arab]

12 hours ago, garydavidson said:

Table is very grim right now: 

The colours make it easy to see…..three cornered Tayside battle to avoid the drop!  This is going to be a terrible spring for us all….

[rik2304]

Nevermind eh.....it was REALLY shit in the 80s.

[slambrother]

Definitely some improvement but we still look like a shadow of the side we have been.   Like others I can’t think of the last time I saw May put his foot through the ball and have a decent shot at goal - losing a yard of pace is one thing but combine it with not being able to strike the ball is another.    I hope for Cleary it’s just a case of getting used to Scottish football as didn’t think he had the best of starts either.  
 

As things stand at this moment in time I can only realistically see us being able to get ahead of Dundee as the other teams above us seem to have more about them.  It’s like the saying in poker, ‘if you can’t see the sucker at the table it’s you’.  Like other poster said we need to  bring in  more quality in the short time the window is open.but we’re really not in a great place to attract players to the club

[garydavidson]

25 minutes ago, Smarmy Arab said:

The colours make it easy to see…..three cornered Tayside battle to avoid the drop!  This is going to be a terrible spring for us all….

At least you built up a good points total before getting into a relegation battle 

Edited January 19, 2022 by garydavidson

[Cagey]

40 minutes ago, Smarmy Arab said:

The colours make it easy to see…..three cornered Tayside battle to avoid the drop!  This is going to be a terrible spring for us all….

25 points is a good starting point. There is no way this Saints team will catch you.

[Aitchy]

I am surprised by the praise of MacPherson. Personally felt he was a passenger last night, although not the only one. 

Felt the three centre backs all did ok. McCart is evidently low on confidence, but I dont think Booth is helping him much. Booth was exposed numerous times last nights. If we are going to persist with this system, which it seems we will, then we need our full backs to be able to offer much more both in an attacking sense and defensively. Booth does not have the legs for the system. I would like to see Gallacher start against Kelty. O'Halloran is not the answer at right wing back either. Hopefully we can get a right back in soon (Corey O'Keffe from Mansfield a name I heard mentioned. Head of Recruitment Rowett strikes again!)

The main issue is our midfield, there is just not enough energy or commitment in there. Butterfield is a tidy enough player, but doesn't have the legs to compete against younger midfielder. Murray Davidson will always give his all, but similar to Butterfield he does not have the energy to compete against opposition players like Cammy Devlin anymore. Up front, I felt Ciftci looked promising. Stevie May cant be faulted for effort, but the quality is no longer there. Watched him closely last night and he spent most of the game chasing about in an almost defensive midfield position. Is it any wonder we struggle for goals when our strikers spends most of their times in midfield or out on the wing? I looked at Hearts when they countered on as last night and they had 5/6 players all trying to get into the box, when we broke forward, the move broke down early on or we only had one player in the box, who was surrounded by 3/4 Hearts players. Its so frustrating and surely a coaching staff of Davidson. Macca and Cleland who have all played at a decent level can see that is one of our main issues.

 

[Pat McGroin]

1 hour ago, Aitchy said:

I am surprised by the praise of MacPherson. Personally felt he was a passenger last night, although not the only one. 

Felt the three centre backs all did ok. McCart is evidently low on confidence, but I dont think Booth is helping him much. Booth was exposed numerous times last nights. If we are going to persist with this system, which it seems we will, then we need our full backs to be able to offer much more both in an attacking sense and defensively. Booth does not have the legs for the system. I would like to see Gallacher start against Kelty. O'Halloran is not the answer at right wing back either. Hopefully we can get a right back in soon (Corey O'Keffe from Mansfield a name I heard mentioned. Head of Recruitment Rowett strikes again!)

The main issue is our midfield, there is just not enough energy or commitment in there. Butterfield is a tidy enough player, but doesn't have the legs to compete against younger midfielder. Murray Davidson will always give his all, but similar to Butterfield he does not have the energy to compete against opposition players like Cammy Devlin anymore. Up front, I felt Ciftci looked promising. Stevie May cant be faulted for effort, but the quality is no longer there. Watched him closely last night and he spent most of the game chasing about in an almost defensive midfield position. Is it any wonder we struggle for goals when our strikers spends most of their times in midfield or out on the wing? I looked at Hearts when they countered on as last night and they had 5/6 players all trying to get into the box, when we broke forward, the move broke down early on or we only had one player in the box, who was surrounded by 3/4 Hearts players. Its so frustrating and surely a coaching staff of Davidson. Macca and Cleland who have all played at a decent level can see that is one of our main issues.

 

Said the same to Barry last night. In this shape, a full back is not enough. Booth has been generally solid in his time here, but we need to try this lad from Liverpool and see if he is more of a wing back. 
 

having to bleed in younger inexperienced players right now is a nightmare, but I think it’s necessary. 

[SaintJet]

16 minutes ago, Pat McGroin said:

Said the same to Barry last night. In this shape, a full back is not enough. Booth has been generally solid in his time here, but we need to try this lad from Liverpool and see if he is more of a wing back. 
 

having to bleed in younger inexperienced players right now is a nightmare, but I think it’s necessary. 

I've alluded to this recentley but it also has a hint of preparing for the future; sadly that looks like being the Chamionship

[Setting Son]

2 hours ago, Smarmy Arab said:

The colours make it easy to see…..three cornered Tayside battle to avoid the drop!  This is going to be a terrible spring for us all….

How did the top scorer in the league get on last night …….. did he even get on ? 

[Setting Son]

2 hours ago, rik2304 said:

Nevermind eh.....it was REALLY shit in the 80s.

Were you not born in the 80’s 

[rik2304]

17 minutes ago, Evansabove said:

Were you not born in the 80’s 

No.

[Johnny B]

There was an improvement in the first half. The big problem of not being able to score we concede a goal the heads go down and the fight diminishes.

Their first goal had been coming all season. 1980s amateurish tactic; over load the right and pump a high ball into the area. At the most it is 50-50 ball if we had someone to win it if we do win it again it becomes a 50-50 ball. It finished up a pin ball they won it and we had left all the space in the world for them to run into. We have been playing this all season long looking for Rooney but nothing ever comes of it. 

Gilmour is not the answer the boy struggled out there and he is not ready to compete at this level. last season division 1 too big a leap. If he had been playing well in the Championship may be yes. Second goal McKay waltzed passed him (did not have the sense to pull him down and take one for the team) then he got in MOH way when he was chasing McKay down. MOH not without fault for the collision.

Where do we go from here down if we cannot keep clean sheets or score goals As was stated 2nd bottom is the best we can hope for.

Big question do we forget about the Scottish cup and concentrate on Dundee next Wednesday?

Edited January 19, 2022 by Johnny B

[Setting Son]

3 hours ago, rik2304 said:

Nevermind eh.....it was REALLY shit in the 80s.

Not for untied and i’dons 

[Widge]

15 minutes ago, Johnny B said:

Big question do we forget about the Scottish cup and concentrate on Dundee next Wednesday?

Absolutely not, you play your strongest team and take it extremely seriously in order to try and stop this losing run. If anything this game possibly decides the Dundee game. If we lose, that's probably it, win, halt the rot and take some semblance of form/confidence from it and use that as a platform. 

[SaintJet]

16 minutes ago, Johnny B said:

There was an improvement in the first half. The big problem of not being able to score we concede a goal the heads go down and the fight diminishes.

Their first goal had been coming all season. 1980s amateurish tactic; over load the right and pump a high ball into the area. At the most it is 50-50 ball if we had someone to win it if we do win it again it becomes a 50-50 ball. It finished up a pin ball they won it and we had left all the space in the world for them to run into. We have been playing this all season long looking for Rooney but nothing ever comes of it. 

Gilmour is not the answer the boy struggled out there and he is not ready to compete at this level. last season division 1 too big a leap. If he had been playing well in the Championship may be yes. Second goal McKay waltzed passed him (did not have the sense to pull him down and take one for the team) then he got in MOH way when he was chasing McKay down. MOH not without fault for the collision.

Where do we go from here down if we cannot keep clean sheets or score goals As was stated 2nd bottom is the best we can hope for.

Big question do we forget about the Scottish cup and concentrate on Dundee next Wednesday?

Definitely forget the cup. GIve some of the fringe players a chance but it would be daft to let Cifti have anymore than a half hour to keep him sharp. The Dundee game is a relegation decider.