Summer transfer window 2024

[Linky]

12 minutes ago, The Kinross Saint said:

If the choice is the status quo or taking a gamble, I'd say gamble.

I'm not particularly concerned about risking the turgid football on offer. Ultimately the worst a manager can do this year is relegate us. That's happening under Levein so why not try something new.

I think a new manager coming in could also be a good opportunity for Webb to understand what the club needs to progress. Levein is going to say everything is fine to him, where as managerial applicants knocking us back because of issues like a lack of scouting may make him think.

Yeah, I can see what you're saying, but we took a gamble with MacLean. I don't think relegation with Levein is a done deal either. I think we look better than we did this time last year (although that isn't saying much, I grant you).

Sorry, all of this is in the wrong topic

[Linky]

1 minute ago, blueheaven said:

I'm all for positive thinking but to still see things in this way, in the face of all evidence we've seen on the pitch and the absolute mess the squad is currently in, really does require the bluest of blue-tinted spectacles. I'm honestly starting to wonder how much longer you can possibly keep defending him.

 

If we hadn't have sacked 2 managers in fairly quick succession so recently, I wouldn't be. I just don't think we can destabilise the club anymore, considering the recent take over. I think some of Levein's signings have been very good, so much so that they actually offer us the chance of becoming a club that takes unknown talent, and sells them on for a decent price. We've signed rubbish too, but I'd rather taking a punt on young players that don't work out rather than 32 year old failures. I look at the squad and see lots of issues, but potential too, something which hasn't been the case for years.

[Gas Monkey]

11 minutes ago, Linky said:

Yeah, I can see what you're saying, but we took a gamble with MacLean. I don't think relegation with Levein is a done deal either. I think we look better than we did this time last year (although that isn't saying much, I grant you).

Sorry, all of this is in the wrong topic

MacLean was not a gamble, he was a lazy and cheap appointment by a Chairman who did not care about the club anymore

[blueheaven]

2 minutes ago, Linky said:

If we hadn't have sacked 2 managers in fairly quick succession so recently, I wouldn't be. I just don't think we can destabilise the club anymore, considering the recent take over. I think some of Levein's signings have been very good, so much so that they actually offer us the chance of becoming a club that takes unknown talent, and sells them on for a decent price. We've signed rubbish too, but I'd rather taking a punt on young players that don't work out rather than 32 year old failures. I look at the squad and see lots of issues, but potential too, something which hasn't been the case for years.

I just don't think it makes sense to stick with someone who we know is doing a terrible job, and liable to make things worse, purely because of bad management decisions that were made in the past. Being "stable" at the bottom of the league will be of no benefit to anyone. I'm all for stability once we've appointed the right manager who can demonstrate that they have what it takes to take us forward for the long haul. What we can't do is stick with failure through sheer fear of change.

I agree that Levein has made a few good signings but he's shown very little aptitude for moulding them into an effective team or building a balanced squad that has the right mix of youth and experience. Selling players on is brilliant but not at the expense of our top flight status. We need to be able to mix those gambles with some reliable figures who can deal with what this season is going to throw at them, and Levein's completely failed to do that.

[SlickDT]

13 minutes ago, blueheaven said:

I just don't think it makes sense to stick with someone who we know is doing a terrible job, and liable to make things worse, purely because of bad management decisions that were made in the past. Being "stable" at the bottom of the league will be of no benefit to anyone. I'm all for stability once we've appointed the right manager who can demonstrate that they have what it takes to take us forward for the long haul. What we can't do is stick with failure through sheer fear of change.

I agree that Levein has made a few good signings but he's shown very little aptitude for moulding them into an effective team or building a balanced squad that has the right mix of youth and experience. Selling players on is brilliant but not at the expense of our top flight status. We need to be able to mix those gambles with some reliable figures who can deal with what this season is going to throw at them, and Levein's completely failed to do that.

I agree with most of that, but I suppose from an owners point of view- looking in black and white.... We were dead and buried. Levein comes in and keeps us up, his signings make a big impact at that point (I would argue we have Derek Adams to thank just as much.) He may be thinking that all these new additions will have a similar effect and is willing to give them time to prove it!?

[Linky]

42 minutes ago, blueheaven said:

I just don't think it makes sense to stick with someone who we know is doing a terrible job, and liable to make things worse, purely because of bad management decisions that were made in the past. Being "stable" at the bottom of the league will be of no benefit to anyone. I'm all for stability once we've appointed the right manager who can demonstrate that they have what it takes to take us forward for the long haul. What we can't do is stick with failure through sheer fear of change.

I agree that Levein has made a few good signings but he's shown very little aptitude for moulding them into an effective team or building a balanced squad that has the right mix of youth and experience. Selling players on is brilliant but not at the expense of our top flight status. We need to be able to mix those gambles with some reliable figures who can deal with what this season is going to throw at them, and Levein's completely failed to do that.

I guess I just don't think the job he's doing is THAT terrible, when you take into account what has gone before. Would we have gone down with Davidson in 2023? Yes, I think so. Would we have gone down with McLean in 2024? Yes, I think so. Are the performances so far this season better than the way we started the last 2? Marginally I'd suggest.

"Reliable figures" - I know what you mean, but let's not kid ourselves, that's what Davidson kept signing and look where that got us. We all know that this summer, Davidson would've signed the likes of Zak Rudden, Lewis Stevenson, Paul Hanlon, Calum Butcher, etc. And given Kane, Considine, McGowan, Brown, Gallacher and CRAWFORD new contracts.

What reliable figures would you sign right now that would be in our price range and would come to us?

[RandomGuy]

1 hour ago, Linky said:

People say Rhys McCabe, well we've just signed who many saw as his top player and he was a joke on Tuesday. Has he got the connections to bring players in? 

 

I don't think many people saw Josh Rae as Airdries best player tbh, but with McCabe what you've seen is a manager who has a clear idea of how he wants to play, is able to get players playing that way, and also has average players playing better than they have at other clubs. This Summer he's lost key players but was quick to replace them and, as it stands, they don't look to have downgraded many positions.

He's pretty clear in terms of how many boxes he ticks and I think he's such an obvious standout you'd be arguing we'd be better doing that regardless of Leveins form as manager as the potential upsides are so big. Going out and targeting a manager on the rise, who's proven at a lower level, feels like the move the club needs to make. If it goes wrong it goes wrong but you applaud the idea and bravery of it IMO.

But we'll probably cling onto Levein too long, McCabe will go elsewhere, and an opportunity to break the cycle will fall away.

[GOB10]

1 hour ago, Linky said:

Lasted 4 months in his last job, with a win percentage of 22%. Worst manager for win rate they've had in the last 10 years. 4th worst of all time, and the other 3 all took over when the club was punching above its weight in the divisions above

I remember at the time he was sacked the fans were outraged at the board as they thought he was bringing a decent style of play to the squad and the owners didn't back him. Hes defo worth a look at

[Strawman]

I know it’s partly sentiment on part but I struggle to believe Stevie May isn’t good enough to get in that squad.

If he isn’t in plans at all, why make him captain in the pre season game at Huntly ? Why let him take the penalty ( I know he won it ) , it would have been better letting someone get their confidence up that would be playing.

Probably reading too much into it.

[Cksaint]

My opinion is he is trying to make saints hearts second string going by the reports in the courier another ex hearts player meant to me signing for us

[Willie Peat]

6 minutes ago, Cksaint said:

My opinion is he is trying to make saints hearts second string going by the reports in the courier another ex hearts player meant to me signing for us

CL's obsession with Hearts is getting beyond a joke.  Even the away strip is maroon with a big H on the front!

[Linky]

32 minutes ago, Willie Peat said:

CL's obsession with Hearts is getting beyond a joke.  Even the away strip is maroon with a big H on the front!

Only rivalled by the fans' obsession with blaming everything on Levein....he doesn't get to choose the kit you know

[Melbourne Saint]

It's a difficult one... CL annoys me with a lack of energy and emotional connection. He's like a teacher you didn't want. Maybe I'm wrong, he's signed some talent. I don't know what the line up is. It's like a garbage bin gone wrong. It takes time to get a team working together, I understand that. But I don't even think I understand the system or players... I remember McVicar, Trainor, Inglis, Maskrey, Ramsey, Roddy, burger boy etc... need a settled 11... To me, Kimbioke and Simbeokeh up front. Pace and physical... A problem for defense 

Edited July 25, 2024 by Melbourne Saint

[PSJ.84]

9 minutes ago, Melbourne Saint said:

Simbeokeh

Nearly 

[Melbourne Saint]

25 minutes ago, PSJ.84 said:

Nearly 

You get what I mean... bloody AI and text profiling 

[The Real Saints]

38 minutes ago, Melbourne Saint said:

To me, Kimbioke and Simbeokeh up front.  

Good grief.

[Melbourne Saint]

31 minutes ago, PSJ.84 said:

Nearly 

Can you spell it on android... !!! I get sex shit which I don't want...

[Linky]

For all the “Stevie May is the answer to our problems, why won’t the manager give him a chance”: XP from last season.

[blueheaven]

15 hours ago, Linky said:

I guess I just don't think the job he's doing is THAT terrible, when you take into account what has gone before. Would we have gone down with Davidson in 2023? Yes, I think so. Would we have gone down with McLean in 2024? Yes, I think so. Are the performances so far this season better than the way we started the last 2? Marginally I'd suggest.

"Reliable figures" - I know what you mean, but let's not kid ourselves, that's what Davidson kept signing and look where that got us. We all know that this summer, Davidson would've signed the likes of Zak Rudden, Lewis Stevenson, Paul Hanlon, Calum Butcher, etc. And given Kane, Considine, McGowan, Brown, Gallacher and CRAWFORD new contracts.

What reliable figures would you sign right now that would be in our price range and would come to us?

The issue with Davidson's signings was that they were at the other extreme. Other than perhaps Phillips and maybe Hallberg, he had no interest in signing players who were likely to bring us a sell-on fee or form part of a longer term plan. He also had no interest in signing or developing youngsters. Way too many of his signings were the wrong side of 32/33. If you look at signings like Carey, Considine, Murphy, McGowan etc - individually I don't think there's anything wrong with signing those guys. The problem comes from signing all of them and filling the team with them.

What I want us to have is balance. Get the spine of the team right as the number one priority. Have experience of the league in there. Have some players aged around 25-30-ish. Guys who have made their mistakes but still have the legs to play with energy and hit their peak. A couple of older players over 32/33 is totally fine in my eyes. And sure, have a couple of project players in the mix, too. And also have a pathway to make sure a couple of our own youngsters are getting their chance. And balance of positions, too: we can't go into the season with a shortage of experienced central defenders, only one left-back, way too many midfielders but none of the type we still need, a surplus of strikers for a system that often only starts games with one striker, and no experienced goalkeeper despite already spending money on a goalkeeper. These gaps and imbalances all point towards bad planning and poor management of the budget.

I can't name who the specific players are who would come to us. None of us can, because we're not in the position of being able to talk to players and ask them what their demands are. Also it's not my job to watch other teams and know who our targets should be. I really only ever watch Saints. But how is it that Tommy Wright was able to sign these types of players and maintain a steady, balanced squad, all while working on a low budget? I think we all know the answer is that it's because he was an infinitely better manager.

 

 

[mike_gain]

20 minutes ago, blueheaven said:

I think we all know the answer is that it's because he was an infinitely better manager.

 

 

Tommy Wright was able to build a much more balanced squad but I also feel one of his real strengths was getting more out of players than perhaps expected. I feel we have the fragments of a decent squad but I'm not confident the current manager will get the most from the players.

[Linky]

28 minutes ago, blueheaven said:

The issue with Davidson's signings was that they were at the other extreme. Other than perhaps Phillips and maybe Hallberg, he had no interest in signing players who were likely to bring us a sell-on fee or form part of a longer term plan. He also had no interest in signing or developing youngsters. Way too many of his signings were the wrong side of 32/33. If you look at signings like Carey, Considine, Murphy, McGowan etc - individually I don't think there's anything wrong with signing those guys. The problem comes from signing all of them and filling the team with them.

What I want us to have is balance. Get the spine of the team right as the number one priority. Have experience of the league in there. Have some players aged around 25-30-ish. Guys who have made their mistakes but still have the legs to play with energy and hit their peak. A couple of older players over 32/33 is totally fine in my eyes. And sure, have a couple of project players in the mix, too. And also have a pathway to make sure a couple of our own youngsters are getting their chance. And balance of positions, too: we can't go into the season with a shortage of experienced central defenders, only one left-back, way too many midfielders but none of the type we still need, a surplus of strikers for a system that often only starts games with one striker, and no experienced goalkeeper despite already spending money on a goalkeeper. These gaps and imbalances all point towards bad planning and poor management of the budget.

I can't name who the specific players are who would come to us. None of us can, because we're not in the position of being able to talk to players and ask them what their demands are. Also it's not my job to watch other teams and know who our targets should be. I really only ever watch Saints. But how is it that Tommy Wright was able to sign these types of players and maintain a steady, balanced squad, all while working on a low budget? I think we all know the answer is that it's because he was an infinitely better manager.

 

 

Tommy was definitely a better manager, although that didn’t seem to translate to Kilmarnock. He took over from a successful time though and built further success. We could therefore have a larger budget, players wanted to come to us. It’s a wholly different job to turn the ship around when we’ve had such a terrible few years. The situation has changed too, with the big clubs all being in the SPL, no Hearts or Rangers in the divisions below. Many clubs have new owners, bigger budgets. The idea that, for example, Aberdeen would be looking fir bids of £6million for their striker a few years ago would be laughable.

I agree it’s not your job to find transfer targets, but this is a forum about the transfer window. I think this close season has been unique in very few players being suggested by people on here. Why? Because, unless like Ikpeazu they have some sort of connection to the manager, known established, quality players simply aren’t going to want to sign for us. We’re the new Ross County.

[garydavidson]

"St Johnstone youth defender Callan Hamill has travelled with Arsenal’s under-18 squad for pre-season, but the 15-year-old is facing a decision on his future as Celtic have tabled a three-year contract offer."

What is the formality with selling children in football these days? Do we have him on a contract that needs a fee or enable us to add on some future clauses?

[Linky]

Also, the comments often come round to “Tommy was a much better manager”. Without doubt. But it’s irrelevant to the situation we’re in. I think in MacLean had taken over from Tommy, he’d have probably done ok, but he couldn’t turn the ship around which is a completely different ask. It’s going to take time to do that for any manager.

[THE LARK SAINT]

45 minutes ago, garydavidson said:

"St Johnstone youth defender Callan Hamill has travelled with Arsenal’s under-18 squad for pre-season, but the 15-year-old is facing a decision on his future as Celtic have tabled a three-year contract offer."

What is the formality with selling children in football these days? Do we have him on a contract that needs a fee or enable us to add on some future clauses?

Development fee

[RandomGuy]

6 minutes ago, Linky said:

Also, the comments often come round to “Tommy was a much better manager”. Without doubt. But it’s irrelevant to the situation we’re in. I think in MacLean had taken over from Tommy, he’d have probably done ok, but he couldn’t turn the ship around which is a completely different ask. It’s going to take time to do that for any manager.

Which is why it's important you get the best manager in for that job as early as you can, and don't fritter time away on a manager you don't think can do that.