O'Rourke

Reality Check!

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If we keep this level of performances up, then i might have to nip down to bookies and stick a shady tenner on McInnes first manager to be sacked!

AWFUL, only word i can think of right now :mad:

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A lot on the forum about fitness, lack of effort, lack of desire etc. etc. But sometimes you just have to accept the better team won. Today we were totally outclassed with Dunfermline completely bossing the middle of the Park and keeping possesion of the ball for huge swathes of the game. We couldn't get out of our own half for the first few minutes of the game and that set the tone for the whole match.

Dunfermline looked an excellent side and in all honesty this is the biggest gulf in quality I have seen between us and one of our rivals in this Division for a number of Years. Early days I know but Dunfermline certainly look a lot slicker than either St Mirren or Hamilton (who we beat 4 - 2 around this time last Year).

It may be were watching the Division One Champions - only time will tell, but I fear on this showing they will not be sporting blue.

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A lot on the forum about fitness, lack of effort, lack of desire etc. etc. But sometimes you just have to accept the better team won. Today we were totally outclassed with Dunfermline completely bossing the middle of the Park and keeping possesion of the ball for huge swathes of the game. We couldn't get out of our own half for the first few minutes of the game and that set the tone for the whole match.

Dunfermline looked an excellent side and in all honesty this is the biggest gulf in quality I have seen between us and one of our rivals in this Division for a number of Years. Early days I know but Dunfermline certainly look a lot slicker than either St Mirren or Hamilton (who we beat 4 - 2 around this time last Year).

It may be were watching the Division One Champions - only time will tell, but I fear on this showing they will not be sporting blue.

i agree thats how i see it.well said bloke.

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Fu**ing dreadful today, Dunfermline were quicker, hungrier, faster and all in all hosed on us!!

We had no desire, no commitment and most of all no idea.

I know its only one game but if that continues we are in serious danger.

I honestly do not know if Del knows what his best team is??

I did not think there was anyone in a Saints jersey today who should have any credit from that game.

A tough week ahead on the training ground me thinks!!

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Today we didnt play as a team.We have a lot of good

players but they dont play as a unit.

There was a lack of shape with no backbone.

Kevin James was terrible he looked like it was his first

game ever,Paul Sheerin looked,well,past it!

The strikers got little or no decent balls but when they got a rare

shot away they lacked accuracy.I reckon their keepers save

from Sammy was his only one of note.

We need a settled line up and we need it now.

Its not time to panic quite yet.Another month of

this mediocrity and we wont need to panic though as there

wont be any point by then

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It goes almost without saying, but that was truely awful. Its been a long time since i have left early, but i was so embarrassed by the nature of the third goal i had too. Disagree with the comments of the trialist, i thought he was dreadful. He must of wasted at least five crosses in the second half alone. To be fair he wasnt the only one that fell in to that bracket. It was worrying that players we normally rely on to keep the ball like craig and sheerin constantly lost the ball or spend large periods of the games adding nothing to proceedings.

The whole back line looked shakey. It probably doesnt help having a goalkeeper who wont come and take crosses in his own six yard box. I pray mains fit next week, it must be a nightmare playing in front of a keeper like that.

All the above said, the real problem lay in midfield today. So so often we gifted posession back without so much as a fight. We sorely missed hardie, which is worrying given he has only played three games after being out for a year. Hopefully it was a bad day at the office for liam, because it was the worst performance ive seen him give in a saints shirt. Sheerin had an off day as well, and i think its obvious he should of come off before he did.

I wouldnt go as far as pass marks but millar and savo were slightly better than the rest

No one is saying the league is over, but its worrying we have started as slow again. As radford said tonight its only 3 points, but if we lose next week it could potentially be 8 points. And of course us saints fans know early season form always ends up counting for nothing in this division.....

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You look forward all week to a game at the weekend and then you get hit with cr** like that. We were worried that two many draws would leave us playing catchup.Defeats at home don't really help too much either!

The real crusher is that there was nothing in that display that offers any hope of a serious challenge. Only Millar seemed up to the necessary stndard. I feel like the season is a write off and we're only 3 games in.

I know there is a lot of games to play and maybe by next week I can get some hope back but right now I am totally depressed.

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A few things...

I'd be inclined to drop Gary Irvine for the trip to Firhil if Anderson is fit as he's been performing poorly ever since the team got back together after the summer. Anderson is a much better defender and instantly had us looking more solid against Ross County in his brief stint at right back before going off injured. We are being ravaged by cross balls, so cutting those out has to be a priority. He may not get forward as much or as well as Irvine but we have midfielders to do that. Plenty of them! Gary Irvines biggest weakness is that he gets caught upfield too often which pulls the centre half out to cover for him. It causes too many problems. He was great for us last season, but that's not enough to keep someone who is underperforming every week in the side.

I thought the midfield missed Hardie today so if he's recovered from his bug, he should come straight back into the side, alongside Morris if fit. Going with Millar and Swankie alongside a slower than usual Paul Sheerin and completely disinterested Liam Craig was a mistake for me. None of these players have any real brute strength. There was no ball winner in there - none of them can tackle all that well. I thought Swankie was one of the poorest players on the pitch before his substitution strangely enough. I suspect he will only be effective for us when we're playing well and flying in a match. He has zero ability to fight.

Upfront, I thought Milne and Holmes were working well together but that was never going to provide any goals with such a poor midfield four in behind them. We looked more threatening once Samuel and Jackson came on but that was a bit short lived. Dunfermline just gave us a going over, we deserved nothing from the match but we have to learn from it. McInnes has to drop people, regardless of what they did for us last season or what we think they can do for us in the future. Present form is not good enough from some, and when there are others waiting for the chance...

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A few things...

I'd be inclined to drop Gary Irvine for the trip to Firhil if Anderson is fit as he's been performing poorly ever since the team got back together after the summer. Anderson is a much better defender and instantly had us looking more solid against Ross County in his brief stint at right back before going off injured. We are being ravaged by cross balls, so cutting those out has to be a priority. He may not get forward as much or as well as Irvine but we have midfielders to do that. Plenty of them! Gary Irvines biggest weakness is that he gets caught upfield too often which pulls the centre half out to cover for him. It causes too many problems. He was great for us last season, but that's not enough to keep someone who is underperforming every week in the side.

I thought the midfield missed Hardie today so if he's recovered from his bug, he should come straight back into the side, alongside Morris if fit. Going with Millar and Swankie alongside a slower than usual Paul Sheerin and completely disinterested Liam Craig was a mistake for me. None of these players have any real brute strength. There was no ball winner in there - none of them can tackle all that well. I thought Swankie was one of the poorest players on the pitch before his substitution strangely enough. I suspect he will only be effective for us when we're playing well and flying in a match. He has zero ability to fight.

Upfront, I thought Milne and Holmes were working well together but that was never going to provide any goals with such a poor midfield four in behind them. We looked more threatening once Samuel and Jackson came on but that was a bit short lived. Dunfermline just gave us a going over, we deserved nothing from the match but we have to learn from it. McInnes has to drop people, regardless of what they did for us last season or what we think they can do for us in the future. Present form is not good enough from some, and when there are others waiting for the chance...

thats a good few words sam!

i agree about gary irvine, he's be poor so far. maybe been coasting without another natural right back waiting in the wings. how ando cannot get a game in any defensive position sometimes baffles me as he is a great defender.

onto the midfield, last week after the morton game i said i felt martin hardie wasnt performing near to what he can, well today showed what he brings to the team. the bite just wasn't there at all. millar needs a guy like morris or hardie alongside him. milliar is a great wee player by the way IMO. sheerins time is up if you ask me, i do like him but he's awfy slow now. liam craig has not looked anything like he was like last year either. i like swankie at times but i dont think he's going to fit in with the mcinnes way of playing.

up front, i liked last seasons 3 of peaso, savo + jacko. i'd go back to that in an instant. holmes looks ok but lacks the threat of the other 3 despite his presence. samuel - well i have bad vibes about him based on what i've seen.

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I think Anderson is still struggling a bit with injury. Playing him at right back is obviously an option McInnes is willing to explore because he put him there against County and he probably would've seen out that match had it not been for the injury. I suspect Irvine would have to settle for a place on the bench as opposed to the midfield if Hardie and Morris were both fit though.

Suggesting McInnes drops some players is always met with hostility on this forum but it's the way things go in football. Players get dropped all of the time when they're not playing well. They'll all work their way back in at some stage. It's better for team and player, than to soldier on when their form is not good.

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Suggesting McInnes drops some players is always met with hostility on this forum but it's the way things go in football.

sometimes you gotta be cruel to be kind if you know what i mean. all for the good of the team and that..........

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Right he goes.

McLean.drop.

Irvine.Not had a decent game yet.Get him tae feck

James.been average.

Rusty.Crap,just crap.Get him tae feck.

Smith.Been average.

Millar..pretty good.

Hardie.Poor so far but will come good.(Please God)

Swankie.Okay but needs to get to the fecking bye-line

Craig.been average.

Sheerin.Love him, but he,s been shit more than he,s not been.

Morris.Oh how I,m hoping...

Savo.What a trier

Holmes.Been okay.

Jacko.Looks a bit off the pace but will come good.

Samuel.I,m hopeful.

Peaso.Not good.

McCaffery.Who fecking knows???

Weatherston. Ditto.

Ando.Okay

Main.Not fecked up yet.

That makes painful reading.

Conclusion:Unless we improve radically and quickly ,we can say bye-bye to ANY thoughts of promotion ( again).Thats My reality.

please feel free to dis m, I don,t care:mad:

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Right he goes.

McLean.drop.

Irvine.Not had a decent game yet.Get him tae feck

James.been average.

Rusty.Crap,just crap.Get him tae feck.

Smith.Been average.

Millar..pretty good.

Hardie.Poor so far but will come good.(Please God)

Swankie.Okay but needs to get to the fecking bye-line

Craig.been average.

Sheerin.Love him, but he,s been shit more than he,s not been.

Morris.Oh how I,m hoping...

Savo.What a trier

Holmes.Been okay.

Jacko.Looks a bit off the pace but will come good.

Samuel.I,m hopeful.

Peaso.Not good.

McCaffery.Who fecking knows???

Weatherston. Ditto.

Ando.Okay

Main.Not fecked up yet.

That makes painful reading.

Conclusion:Unless we improve radically and quickly ,we can say bye-bye to ANY thoughts of promotion ( again).Thats My reality.

please feel free to dis m, I don,t care:mad:

Ghost, you said on another post it took you five hours to calm down after that match. I agree with all your comments, but I totally disagree about the five hours. I'll be raging for days.

I'm getting fed up of Irvine's lack of defensive play. Someone criticised me, DaveMc I think, on here after the Dingwall display when I said that if he is no. 2 then he plays right back and doesn't drift inside or into midfield. Some crap about if I'd ever played at a decent level of fitba! I don't need to have played to see how namby pamby, pushover, soft, tippy tappy and (dare I say it) girlie he's been playing. And he's not alone.

I'll be more rational later in the week, so meantime, pick faults with what we're all saying if you like :cool:

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Right he goes.

McLean.drop.

Irvine.Not had a decent game yet.Get him tae feck

James.been average.

Rusty.Crap,just crap.Get him tae feck.

Smith.Been average.

Millar..pretty good.

Hardie.Poor so far but will come good.(Please God)

Swankie.Okay but needs to get to the fecking bye-line

Craig.been average.

Sheerin.Love him, but he,s been shit more than he,s not been.

Morris.Oh how I,m hoping...

Savo.What a trier

Holmes.Been okay.

Jacko.Looks a bit off the pace but will come good.

Samuel.I,m hopeful.

Peaso.Not good.

McCaffery.Who fecking knows???

Weatherston. Ditto.

Ando.Okay

Main.Not fecked up yet.

That makes painful reading.

Conclusion:Unless we improve radically and quickly ,we can say bye-bye to ANY thoughts of promotion ( again).Thats My reality.

please feel free to dis m, I don,t care:mad:

Jim out of curiosity where do you sit at the park, is it jsut to the right of the dugout in the main stand??

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Jim out of curiosity where do you sit at the park, is it jsut to the right of the dugout in the main stand??

No Mate. I,m in the East stand.Why? Is there some moaning miserable never happy doom and gloom merchant sitting over there as well???:laugh:

I have a very loud shout though so maybe you can here me whining and screaming obscenities at various useless individuals( Normally Referees).Today was not normal so they all got some.

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Going with Millar and Swankie alongside a slower than usual Paul Sheerin and completely disinterested Liam Craig was a mistake for me.

IMO Sheerin would have been rested but with MMM's illness keeping him out of the team he had to play Peanut and no Morris meant the mf picked itself so where was the mistake?

in fact the whole team picked itself-Main was not match fit with the mid-week friendly being cancelled so he had to pick McLean. Ando is injured so the full backs were obvious and James and Rusty playing together was a good all as Del is wanting to get a settled team and playing your 2best cb's(which most of us picked before the game). Holmes and Savo have looked the best out of the forwards before today so i don't think Del can be blamed for the selection.

Maybe he can be blamed for the tactics or lack of motivation from the team today but i'm putting this one behind me as 1 of those freak games where everyone had their stinker on the same day and Dunfermline were on top form.

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Quote from Ginagapar on P&B:

'back to the pars though. i've said of this season that all i need to see on the park to be happy is a team going out and giving it their all for the sake of the wee triangle on there right tit. with results like today, i think we've proven how much of a difference that really does make in this league!'

Sums it up for me. Pars were great. Played like Hamilton did last year. We looked lightweight at Dingwall, and everywhere else since, although MMM makes a difference.

McInnes can have a great time with his computer analysis and sophisticated university sports training methodologies. Look at all the fancy kit and training methods in the Olympics 100 metres - but a guy with long legs, talent and an ordinary pair of shorts - not tights - won by a huge margin, and beat the world record.

A bit of work ethic and effort would be good right now, Derek. Freak result or not, it's been coming since Dingwall. Diddy cup or not.

See. I'm still raging.

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A few things...

I thought the midfield missed Hardie today so if he's recovered from his bug, he should come straight back into the side, alongside Morris if fit. Going with Millar and Swankie alongside a slower than usual Paul Sheerin and completely disinterested Liam Craig was a mistake for me. None of these players have any real brute strength. There was no ball winner in there - none of them can tackle all that well. I thought Swankie was one of the poorest players on the pitch before his substitution strangely enough. ...

Hate to have a go at individual players but I have often feared that Swankie is a luxury player, who can maybe come off the bench and turn a game. But in a midfield that has to graft and mix it - sorry its not his game.

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Hate to have a go at individual players but I have often feared that Swankie is a luxury player, who can maybe come off the bench and turn a game. But in a midfield that has to graft and mix it - sorry its not his game.

Yesterday he would have been better not turning up but previous games he's looked one of our best players . Tho Dee did warn us that he only played well in the big games. he said he only played well against us and that's why we thought he was one of their best players

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Hate to have a go at individual players but I have often feared that Swankie is a luxury player, who can maybe come off the bench and turn a game. But in a midfield that has to graft and mix it - sorry its not his game.

If a player isnt pulling their weight in the side then thats down to the manager to deal with....i kno we can all have swipes at players in general-but what we do or say can only be dealt with by hard management.

Its not been the start that most of us would want and hopefully Del/Tony can sort this out-if they cant then thats down to them.

I just cant believe there are those around wanting to believe that the championship is over before the season has been started - we have to believe.

For the "younger" ones that profess the doom and gloom...be patient....ive been going to games now for 46 years and you never give up .

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Aye, we played pish but the only positive we can take away from the game is that we can't play any worse. We need to get behind the players and give them some confidence to make them bounce back- although i have to say it was pretty hard not to shout at any of the players yesterday. Lets bring a big away suppport to partick and cheer on the saints. YELLOW ARMY!

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No Mate. I,m in the East stand.Why? Is there some moaning miserable never happy doom and gloom merchant sitting over there as well???:laugh:

I have a very loud shout though so maybe you can here me whining and screaming obscenities at various useless individuals( Normally Referees).Today was not normal so they all got some.

No there is one sitting to the right hand side of the dugouts who takes great pleasure in moaning the day lights out of everyone in the area, and I think his name is Jim, but you are far more sensible than him :-)

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