An open letter to St Johnstone Chairman Steve Brown

[john1962]

And they announced a no vote today as well. Unless I have been lied to (which I doubt, as the source is as honest as they come), Steven Brown was NOT at Hampden yesterday. He was at McD all day..

Very curious??

Very, I remember reading about this meeting last week. So who represented Saints?

[john1962]

Oh and stop all being so blind to what is in front of you. Our club like many others are trying to pull the wool over our eyes and treat us like mugs. Saints and sb will know exactly what has been said and 'agreed' not sure, but last time I checked, Glasgow had phone lines and mobile reception. If sb wasn't there in person it may be, just may be the case that he dialed in to the meeting? Just a thought.

People say things that they want others to hear to keep them happy. I know it is a difficult concept for some on here to grasp, but some people bend the truth! I know, hard to believe eh?

Video conferencing makes it all easy nowadays.

[null vier]

In what other business could you get away with treating your 'customers' so badly.

What is forgotten is that the customers of Sky in respects to Scottish football are the very same fans who they are hacking off!! It is not as if there is too much interest in Scottish football from out-with Scotland. Why on earth would anyone want to get involved in sponsoring or doing a tv deal with any league that is so clearly rigged and that you may get 'backlash' from the very customers you are trying to attract?

The SPL has been a massive failure and has created an atmosphere of self preservation and protectionism. Up until the SPL, we had well run and financed teams, decent crowds, genuine competition and sponsors. What do we have now? Only 11 teams, mistrust, 4 administrations, 2 liquidations, 12 years of rigging, no sponsor, a really poor tv deal, loads of debt and no fans. Who has benefited from all of this? Look at all of those millionaire former Rangers players who rode to the rescue in their hour of need? Look at Stefan Adam and Freddie Lungberg giving a monkeys about Scottish football. Craig Hignett and David Obua both earning over 10k a week in SPL, what did they contribute? Excluding Inverness and Ross County as they weren't there, is there any SPL ground that looks any different now than it did in 1998 (with the exception of St Mirren obviously)?

It is so telling that where there was once genuine rivalry between fans, there is now a massive commonality. We all have more of a sense of togetherness with fans from other clubs than we do with our own teams. Totally crazy!!

As has been said many times, if this was some league in a South American of African country, you'd say that, that kind of this is shocking and be thankful that such a thing would never happen in Scotland.

It is a total embarrassment to the whole country. In the last 3 seasons, we have had the whole Rangers mess, Celtic intimidating the refs to such a point that they went on strike, Hearts and Dunfermline not paying wages, Saints v Aberdeen getting just over 1k fans to a game and on and on and on.

Possibly the most ridiculous of all though, is that Ross county have not only been asked to destroy a perfectly good stadium to put in a whole load of seats to take its seated capacity to be over 115% of the population of the town from which they come, but even worse, then to be told that a couple of dozen of them don't county as they are 'restricted view' so they have now had to build one of the gazebo stands with 200 seats to satisfy the 6k seats, even though they have 6,063 seats already?!? All before the 1st of July to satisfy the SPL rules, even though they do not know which teams they will be playing until after that date.

Yep! Great post. "Vote Yellow Box for SPL chairman!"

When the facts are as glaringly obvious as this, why do the fannies running the game struggle to see what needs to be changed?

Why can't the SPL board be a bit more honest and open about what is going on?

SPL board - not fit for purpose.

[john1962]

Alex Thompson has tweeted that Hampden have been inundated by angry fans demanding integrity.

Well done the Scottish football supporter. We can't be bought bribed or blackmailed. Well most of us can't, not do sure about the secret seven

[O'Rourke]

We can't be bought bribed or blackmailed. Well most of us can't, not do sure about the secret seven

I'm always open to offers mate.

[john1962]

I'm always open to offers mate.

Don't I know that?

[Abernethy Saint]

I don't know what to think about all this. Gobsmacked does't come close.

I've always been an anti-conspiracy theory person. There's a famous quote that goes along the lines of "why look for malice when the stupidity is so obvious". The me of a month ago would have said something along the lines of (if you can be arsed, read to the end!!):

1. No conspiracy as such. Just a bunch of folk totally overwhelmed by events, making it up as they go along, clearly lacking sophisticated strategic/PR/financial advice. In essence, no one has a clue what is going on, they'e blundering from one PR disaster to another, but hey, give them a break, they probably have the best interests of footy at heart, long-term strategy, helicopter view and all that.

2. You're all being far too emotional. If you'd been offered this level of punishment along with Div One for the stiffy ****, you'd have been delighted, even a few weeks ago. Get a grip.

I'm perhps 5% still this But I'm 95%:

DO THESE PEOPLE THINK WE'RE FECKIN MORONS? GET THEM TAE FECK!!!!

It is incredible how far the stakes have risen in so short a time, thanks you you lot and fellow non-fascist club supporters. We do seem now to have a scenario whereby, if this frankly disgusting plot is not forced through, it seems impossible to see how so many orphan issues could be resolved in ntime to see the stiffy **** slide gently into Div 3, and the league season kick of in time.

We must be very close to looking at a delay to the start of the season, legal challenges galore, court/Government/UEFA/FIFA intervention etc etc.

This a feckin shambles. It's feckin embarrassing. What a glorious summer of sport we have, and yet the bit of it we really, really care about is melting down faster than a fat man in a crem.

[The ghost of Jim Morton]

Alex Thompson has tweeted that Hampden have been inundated by angry fans demanding integrity.

Well done the Scottish football supporter. We can't be bought bribed or blackmailed. Well most of us can't, not do sure about the secret seven

Having spent £600 today I would be delighted to take a bribe as funds are low. Can you tell me how to go about this??

Yours,

Peter..

[Blues Brother]

Wonder who the senior source is?

alex thomson ‏@alextomo

SFL powerpoint document should be met with utter contempt by all decent football fans - senior source in Hampden Pk tells #c4news

[john1962]

Having spent £600 today I would be delighted to take a bribe as funds are low. Can you tell me how to go about this??

Yours,

Peter..

The way your tune has been changing I thought you would be able to tell us

[Kilgour]

You are right about "the game" bit. Because Scottish football's certainly not a sport any more if this proposal goes through.

If you really want to continue paying good money to support a corrupt, rigged system, then that's your choice. But I will tell you this - if this proposal does go through, there will be even fewer supporters in the grounds than would have been the case if NewCo had conned their way into the SPL.

You are way out of sync with the mainstream feeling on this, but like I say, it's your choice.

Percy I totally respect your view but please dont place me in the minority.

I may be in the minority in the eyes of the vocal or keyboard punters but not in the real world.We are all entitled to our opinion and I respect yours.The original plan was to oust RFC from SPL, now its turning very vindictive.Put yourself for a minute in the shoes of a real Gers fan that pays their way every week and not the knuckledraggers that populate forums etc,

Woul you like to suddenly have no club to support. Thought not.Lets punish those responsible,feel sorry for those that have been diddled and please lets get on with SPL minus one half of the dreaded OF. COYS

[Sandaza-Claus]

As a Saints fan living and working in Glasgow I just thought that i'd point out that every Rangers season ticket holder (and frequent match attendee) i've spoken to has said to me that they're more than happy to drop down to the Third Division - they just want to see their team and don't want any preferential treatment. Seem quite keen on a change of stadium-scenery too...

From what I can see, it's the glory-hunting (Celtic-hating) Rangers fans that don't want to drop all the way down cause it harms their pathetic ego's when they're confronted by a Sellik fan...

Who actually cares about these inbred bunch of numpties? Apparently the SPL and SFA do...

[Jiangsu Sainty]

I think the third would be good, and im not sure where the money loss figures come from, as I am sure that the Gers would still take massive crowds to 3rd div grounds, giving lower league clubs more money. It would be ideal for the to start at the bottom and fund the scottish clubs one league at a time

[The ghost of Jim Morton]

The way your tune has been changing I thought you would be able to tell us

My Tune at the start was simply that I would not return to McD if ANY newco club were given addmittance. That has remained firm throughout. That there seems to be a sneaky plan to get this particular newco into the SFL 1st Division is not pleasing me in the least and I oppose it vehemently. This though, is another issue which the teams of the SFL need to fight. I will happily lend my full support to these guys but the original cause I was fighting has ( well at least i believe has) been won.

Rangers WILL NOT be in the SPL..

That above all else is what I fought for..

[ryangordon86]

Percy I totally respect your view but please dont place me in the minority.

I may be in the minority in the eyes of the vocal or keyboard punters but not in the real world.We are all entitled to our opinion and I respect yours.The original plan was to oust RFC from SPL, now its turning very vindictive.Put yourself for a minute in the shoes of a real Gers fan that pays their way every week and not the knuckledraggers that populate forums etc,

Woul you like to suddenly have no club to support. Thought not.Lets punish those responsible,feel sorry for those that have been diddled and please lets get on with SPL minus one half of the dreaded OF. COYS

Gus, I wanted Rangers punished appropriately. as a club Rangers no longer exist.

1st Division is not an appropriate level for a new club to enter the Scottish football setup

[monkfish]

Percy I totally respect your view but please dont place me in the minority.

I may be in the minority in the eyes of the vocal or keyboard punters but not in the real world.We are all entitled to our opinion and I respect yours.The original plan was to oust RFC from SPL, now its turning very vindictive.Put yourself for a minute in the shoes of a real Gers fan that pays their way every week and not the knuckledraggers that populate forums etc,

Woul you like to suddenly have no club to support. Thought not.Lets punish those responsible,feel sorry for those that have been diddled and please lets get on with SPL minus one half of the dreaded OF. COYS

It's not vindictive at all to expect them to receive the same treatment as anyone else. You surely can't be so naieve as to think removing them from the SPL was the real issue? The point for most is to see equal treatment of all member clubs i.e sporting integrity. Allowing them into sfl spits in the face of that.

[monkfish]

Taking another angle, not saying this is my personal opinion as such...

What if the commercial impact of putting the Rangers Newco into Division 3 is as great as the SFL suggest in their proposal document today?

If Sky, Clydesdale Bank, etc. withdrew all existing contracts and sought compensation, the cost to the SPL clubs would be very hefty indeed. The amount quoted is £16M, which is a massive amount to lose in the short term. The majority of clubs, all of whom have ongoing contractual commitments, would suffer cash-flow problems and those with heavy existing debts would be either on or over the edge.

If, and I say if, this is the case (none of us know the figures involved), would you not accept Rangers in Division 1 in order to save the existence of your club? It was quoted on Twitter that up to five clubs would "go bust" if Rangers were put down to Division 3. If that is true, I think we would just have to admit that Rangers are too big to fail and you would have to create a safety net. To safeguard the continued existence of St Johnstone FC, it might be a necessary evil.

Reminds me of the government/RBS/other failed banks situation to be honest.

Good post, and tbh I could be persuaded if there was an honest debate and the clubs held thier hands up and said "we have made a mess of Scottish football, Rangers are too big to fail. We will make an allowance on the condition that fundamental change is made so this can't happen again."

That is not what's happening, it's backroom deals and duplicity. If we can't deal with this fundamental issue honestly and openly, what is the hope for the future?

[monkfish]

Ps I include Steve Brown in that previous posts' condemnation. Why can't he present the issues to the fans clearly and honestly?

[john1962]

My Tune at the start was simply that I would not return to McD if ANY newco club were given addmittance. That has remained firm throughout. That there seems to be a sneaky plan to get this particular newco into the SFL 1st Division is not pleasing me in the least and I oppose it vehemently. This though, is another issue which the teams of the SFL need to fight. I will happily lend my full support to these guys but the original cause I was fighting has ( well at least i believe has) been won.

Rangers WILL NOT be in the SPL..

That above all else is what I fought for..

It's the sneaky bit that gets me. If the clubs had come out and said we are going to vote no but the price for that is reconstruction with newco in SFL1 I would have accepted it. Not 100% happy but would have got on with it. I have always said that wholesale changes to the system may be a price we have to pay. At least treat us like adults and let us make our own decisions. At the moment it looks like we were told that clubs are voting no just to get season ticket money.

[monkfish]

My Tune at the start was simply that I would not return to McD if ANY newco club were given addmittance. That has remained firm throughout. That there seems to be a sneaky plan to get this particular newco into the SFL 1st Division is not pleasing me in the least and I oppose it vehemently. This though, is another issue which the teams of the SFL need to fight. I will happily lend my full support to these guys but the original cause I was fighting has ( well at least i believe has) been won.

Rangers WILL NOT be in the SPL..

That above all else is what I fought for..

Looks to me like you're clinging to a technicality that allows you to save face. What did keeping them out of the SPL achieve that allowing them back in to division 1 won't destroy?

[soulfulsaint]

Alex Thompson's latest blog savages the SPL 'document'

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/scottish-footballs-chance-saloon/2091

...and with tongue firmly in cheek ends with the killer lines:

<i> "The fans aren’t daft and they’ll not buy this, nor should the clubs – even those who’ve long hankered for the two-tier SPL.

It should all be about real change, real opportunities for clubs who are not toxic and for Rangers to have the chance – genuinely, credibly, cleanly – to put this behind them, do their time and come good as they surely will, with any deserved bragging rights earned the hard way in coming years.

Don’t take my word – pop up the A9 to the new hotbed of European football in Scotland – Perth.</i>

Yeessss!!!

[andy rhodes fancy watch]

Rangers were liquidated , fact . This sevco has bought the footballing assets so naturally should have to apply to join the sfl as they aren't getting in the spl . The sfl should ask their members where they should come in , if it was me it would be the third but it is a vote for sfl clubs to make .

[monkfish]

Alex Thompson's latest blog savages the SPL 'document'

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/scottish-footballs-chance-saloon/2091

...and with tongue firmly in cheek ends with the killer lines:

<i> "The fans aren’t daft and they’ll not buy this, nor should the clubs – even those who’ve long hankered for the two-tier SPL.

It should all be about real change, real opportunities for clubs who are not toxic and for Rangers to have the chance – genuinely, credibly, cleanly – to put this behind them, do their time and come good as they surely will, with any deserved bragging rights earned the hard way in coming years.

Don’t take my word – pop up the A9 to the new hotbed of European football in Scotland – Perth.</i>

Yeessss!!!

Saints - the antithesis of ra peepul

Let's keep it that way!

[john1962]

Alex Thompson's latest blog savages the SPL 'document'

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/scottish-footballs-chance-saloon/2091

...and with tongue firmly in cheek ends with the killer lines:

<i> "The fans aren’t daft and they’ll not buy this, nor should the clubs – even those who’ve long hankered for the two-tier SPL.

It should all be about real change, real opportunities for clubs who are not toxic and for Rangers to have the chance – genuinely, credibly, cleanly – to put this behind them, do their time and come good as they surely will, with any deserved bragging rights earned the hard way in coming years.

Don’t take my word – pop up the A9 to the new hotbed of European football in Scotland – Perth.</i>

Yeessss!!!

Tomo live on Scottish football tonight C4 news

[Noose76]

Alex Thompson's latest blog savages the SPL 'document'

http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/scottish-footballs-chance-saloon/2091

...and with tongue firmly in cheek ends with the killer lines:

<i> "The fans aren’t daft and they’ll not buy this, nor should the clubs – even those who’ve long hankered for the two-tier SPL.

It should all be about real change, real opportunities for clubs who are not toxic and for Rangers to have the chance – genuinely, credibly, cleanly – to put this behind them, do their time and come good as they surely will, with any deserved bragging rights earned the hard way in coming years.

Don’t take my word – pop up the A9 to the new hotbed of European football in Scotland – Perth.</i>

Yeessss!!!

Shameful plug!