7-2 Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Its frustrating not scoring again, but surely a point away to Dunfrmline isnt a bad result? Would certainly have settled for it before the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pavel Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Should Weatherston have been dropped? When you consider who could have been dropped instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodgers Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Apparently we should have won with a last minute goal - Jacko chased a lost cause in to the corner, played it across only for Sheerin to blaze it over the bar from six yards... i heard the same! pish suppose its better than a loss - just looking on the brightside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calinho Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 bring back savo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poang Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Apparently we should have won with a last minute goal - Jacko chased a lost cause in to the corner, played it across only for Sheerin to blaze it over the bar from six yards... just back and yup, thats exactly what happened. I still cant believe it, dont think ive ever witnessed such a bad miss before. Would of been robbery though, we were absolute guff for about 85mins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlairSaint Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Pathetic display, should have got beat to be honest. When are we going to start dominating games like we used to instead of waiting for a lucky break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainstand Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Thought we looked good when we changed things and took off McInnes. Weatherstone wide right with Quinn moving in one. definately finished the stronger team and should have had a penalty in the first half when bamba used Duechars as a climbing frame. Overall a point away at dunfermline is not a bad result. When you consider the chances that were missed at Clyde and Sheerin today we should be a good few points better off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali91 Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 i thought we were quite good today. Dunfermline controlled the first thirty minutes but the rest of the match was quite even imo until we dominated the last ten or so minutes. how did sheerin manage to put that wide? no need for the boos at the end either imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cagey Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Glass is half full MS.I wish I had your optimism. Ando left back.McInness in the team,Weatherston dropped for Quinn,Stewart in the team . Coyle has lost the plot completely. We are in for a long hard season. Only created 1 chance & that in injury time against a team that has played a hard game on Thursday + flight.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rossi the Sailor Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 From Hero to Zero!!! other poor game!! too many high long pass, some player cant ever pass right!!! should got last mins goal!! but dunfermline goalie only made 1 or 2 save, easy afternoon for him!! no good enough!!! 11 points gap!! that is a big ask!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintSam1884 Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 I'm beginning to lose faith in a manager who just cannot see the problem areas in the team. I don't know whether Coyle genuinely believes we need McInnes' experience or whether it's friendship ruling on that one, but McInnes has been consistently poor all season and yet he managed to pick up a starting jersey in yet another match? The midfield that started the match was all wrong, and Dunfermline bossed us until Weatherston was introduced onto the wing and Quinn moved into a more central position alongside Hardie, which seemed to suit him much better. I can also not quite find the words to sum up my feelings on John Stewart being in the 16, let alone starting the match. I've seen him a few times now and he has to be one of the worst footballers I've ever seen in my time as a Saints supporter. A lack of ability coupled with a poor attitude and lazy movement make him far too poor to even be considered a starter for a team with supposed title aspirations. Deuchar got his first start and did well holding the ball up and winning headers from the standard lump out of defence, but he was as much playing upfront himself and Stewart just couldn't provide the movement for his partner. I liked the look of Deuchar but what a poor move from Coyle to play Stewart alongside him. In theory, a fast player in alongside a player like Deuchar works but Stewart is just bone idle. Can you imagine if he'd been presented with the opportunity that Jackson did so well out of at the end of the match? There's no doubt whatsoever in my mind that Stewart would've just accepted that it was going out. Yet again we start with a sub-standard line up, with three of our most on form players on the bench and leave introducing these players into the match much too late for them to turn our fortunes around. If Coyle cannot see that McInnes needs time out, and Stewart is just not good enough then I don't really know what to say. He simply HAS to see it. Very disappointing once again and four points from a possible fifteen leaves us eleven behind league leaders Hamilton, a team whom we finished miles ahead of last season. There's no excuses for that, it's no longer about the players. The end of today and the end of Tuesday night showed that we do have the players, but the manager is time and time again getting it wrong. We cannot go on living off of the back of last season when we are not performing and falling further and further behind the leaders every week. At this rate it's going to be a relegation battle we are caught up in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimmerman Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 It took us till the 85th minute to have a shot on target that pretty much sums the game up. Never mind the strikeforce, we have the slowest midfield in the division and that is the downfall. We need to stop thinking about promotion and start thinking about getting a decent team first. As realistically, im not bitter here or angry but we are not getting promoted. Dunfermline deserved the points as they were far quicker and created more chances, although they clearly need a striker. Irvine had a shocker at the back and the wee left winger had him in his pocket all game, irvine just sat and watched him all game. Hopefully he will get better. To the same extent harper was getting the better of ando, but ando was out of position and at least stood up to him. How did stewart actually become a professional player, im very harsh here and I feel for the guy as he was clearly gutted when he came off, but he is dire and should be sent back. The positives? We looked far better when we hooked stewart and finally mciness and we had some decent drive with peaso, wetherston and jacko. Also deuchar is clearly going to be a good addition to the squad as long as we can add someone that isnt stewart to play alongside him! Rocco played average and i feel he could come onto a game. However as someone said earlier about his time at kilmarnock, he strolled through the game. With all dunfermlines possesion and the fact it would have been daylight robbery, how the feck did sheerin miss that chance? I cant actually slag mciness too much, as it wasnt his worst game, but what did he actually do in the game. He didnt get forward and everytime the pars got the ball he never had the legs to catch them. Sheerin needs to be moved inside with jinky on the wing. Its a total farce (unless injured) that jinky never got a jersey today! As for daal? On wednesday night neither stewart or mciness should get stripped, simple. This will show them they need to fight for their shirt. With all these negatives, i can still see us turning the corner if coyle starts playing football rather than making friends. I just cant see us winning the league. mon the saints! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_Beatson Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Before the game today I was talking about Saints with my girlfriend as we drove along. She has been watching Saints since December last year and has watched maybe 20 games in that time. Her thoughts (without me prompting her or telling her this) were that 1 - McInnes is rubbish and spends to much time arguing with his teammates when it is in fact him that is playing badly, 2 - Stewart is a dreadful footballer and 3 - There is no pace or flair in the middle of the park. If a girl who has watched very little football in her lifetime can spot this, and our manager, who has 20 years of playing at a good level to his name, can't I am extremely worried. Often managers do see things we don't, e.g a player's performance in training, but as SaintSam says (and I think she sums things up perfectly) he simply HAS to see the problems we have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 I've held back so far this season, giving the boys a chance, but I have had it with this display! How people can say were were "quite good" is beyond me! We were terrible, and Dunfermline ran us ragged most of the game. I have lost nearly all faith in Coyle! McInnes starts - theres a shock, McInnes - barely touches the ball, couldn't make a successful tackles, and offered no pass at all - Theres a surprise. Get him tae ****! Coyle seriously is clueless if he continues to play shite like McInnes and Stewart, and leave players like Jackson(who changed the game and did more in 10 mins than Stewart did the time he was on) and Moon. I think it took till the 88th minute for us to get our first short on target. We did have one off target before that though! I think we have defended certain players to much and also Coyle. That's the last time I spend my hard earned cash(which I have very little of) watching shite like that. IF Coyle plays McInnes and Stewart in the next game - He'll be next on the "get tae fek" line. Its time we forgot about the heroics last year and looked at the mess were in now. Relegation form which doesnt look like improving. A manager who can't see where the problem lies, and who plays "his mates" when they clearly aren't good enough! Losing the faith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perth-Saint Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 how did he miss that? good grief As for the rest of the game, first half was shocking although we were much, much improved after Stewart & McInnus made way for Weatherston & MacDonald. If we start with the team next time that finished today we will begin to win games (and McCluskey into the equation for Sheerin - Why was he out the squad today?) I believe thats now 340 minutes without a goal - most of second half against Dundee, whole game against Clyde, Partick and now Dunfermline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Oh, and I now think Sheerin is coming close to being past it. He doesn't have the legs anymore to be on the wing. His balls into the box were crap also! Your suppose to attack a corner, but every ball was "floated" in with no pace behind the attacking players in the box, so they are then having to try and head the ball while moving backwards! And why do we always do that stupid thing when we have centre. We never win the header and end up with possession! Why not play it back and keep possession for the first minute and try to get players on the ball and settle them quicker. I'm fed up of that too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SavotheGreat Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Sam, spot on. Totally and utterly spot on. Pretty much exactly what I was going to post. Afairly sub-standard game today, long and aimless hoofs up the park all throughout the first half, Alan's kicking was wayward for large parts of it. Not really sure what the plan of action was. As Sam has already pointed out, Stewart barely qualified as a football player today. A headless chicken perhaps, but not a football player. He continually ran after everything, good on him, but he never caught up to it. He ran and he ran and he ran, always looking like he wanted to get a hold of the ball but never actually doing anything with it. On the two occassions when he actually got it, he lost it. He's not first division standard, simple as that. More often than not, he was looking for the long ball over, he was relying on it, but that is pointless when: 1. you can't catch it and 2. when you get it you can't actually do anything with it. Deuchar did fine, but we didn't play to his strengths. Too often the ball was hoofed up to him and he won the header, but with no support. What we need from Deuchar is for him to be in the box. We need a midfielder to win possession. Play it out to the wing, swing it into the box and THAT is where Deuchar should be. Of course he's useful when it comes to retaining one of Alan's wayward albeit endearing kicks (somehow it wasn't overly endearing when Bryn did it, maybe it has something to do with the fact he was shite), but that shouldn't be his principle purpose. Let Hardie win it, and get yourself into the box. McInnes. Useless. Not at this level. Agree with Sam, he needs punted, but then again, i've been saying that since the end of last season. His marking was non-existent, he strayed continually, he couldn't pick anyone up, he couldn't keep up with anyone. His distribution was ok, but it did consist of 10 yard passes (which is fine for a holding midfielder), but that's not what he's there for. He need's to break up the play and get the ball to a creative player. He didn't do that today, in fact he hasn't done that all season. The left side of midfield was pretty much redundant, for reasons i've outlined in the Anderson thread. I'm not overly sure about Sheerin. I would be tempted to say he should be moved in field and that he's not got the pace for that left-side. But then again, does he need pace. His distribution from that sides is usually terrific, if we can subsidise that with the pace and penetrative running of either Dyer of Stanic then we shouldn't really have a problem. I felt Rocco did fine. He had a pretty decent attempt on goal in the first half, stinging just right of the post. Like Sam identified, he was better when Coyle moved him in field. There was an energy in the team. In fairness to OC, he made the right substitutions. But again, the team that ended up on the park at the end of the 90 minutes was the team which should have started the match, IMO (with the only exception of Dyer in for Ando; i'm not sure if OC just feels the need to field ALL of his better players, even if he's playing them out of position? Anyway, that's a separate point). Weatherston did well when he came on, there were actually strong challenges being made in the centre of the park, we were getting the ball forward with momentum and we were actually stringing passes together. The last eight minutes were really superb! One more thing to add, why was Deuchar being used as wide forward? Time after time the ball was moved out wide, that is where Peaso should have been holding it up and either passing it on or swinging it in for Deuchar to get on the end of. Deuchar was under utilised, we really didn't exploit his best qualities in the match, mind you, I think that had a lot to do with Stewart, who really didn't provide, well, anything whatsoever (no, seriously). There are definite positives there, but we really have to ditch the duds: Stewart, McInnes and Daal. We really have to play players where they are at their best. Be that Anderson at centre-back, Sheerin in field, Weatherston up front, Rocco in field or whatever. Whatever misplaced loyalties Coyle has to these players really needs to be addressed, hopefully he'll see the light and try something new. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUZZ Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 right, no messing about here. this is relegation form. that was poor again and just as well the pars have no real threat up front. coyle is rapidly losing my faith in him i'm afraid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SavotheGreat Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 right, no messing about here. this is relegation form. that was poor again and just as well the pars have no real threat up front. coyle is rapidly losing my faith in him i'm afraid I have nothing but faith. Ditch McInnes, Stewart and Daal, play a left-back at left-back and you've got the core of a championship winning side. When both McInnes and Stewart were subbed, we turned it around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUZZ Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 I have nothing but faith. Ditch McInnes, Stewart and Daal, play a left-back at left-back and you've got the core of a championship winning side. When both McInnes and Stewart were subbed, we turned it around. too much of an old pals act with coyle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scobby_SJFC Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Poor poor poor I can only remember 1 shot on target all afternoon, and that sums it up really. Can anybody explain to me why Sheerin is played on the left hand side and not the middle? he has no pace and will not beat players, where as if he were moved into the centre he could pick passes and hopefully unlock defences. Only people who played well for me were Weatherson, Jackson and the Doc who gave effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el doro Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Ever so slowly a slight improvement. In much the same way as partick midweek, i felt we came onto our game in the last 10/15 mins, however we should be on form from the start, not taking 80 mins to get into the game! Ando should never have been played at left back. It seems ridiculous to contemplate playing a right sided player in that position when there were other options available. Deuchar looked good, held up the ball well and had a positive impact, but playing along-side stewart he was practically on his own, genuinely believe stewart to be one of the worst players in a saints top i've seen in a long time. Quinn looked nothing but average, disappointed weatherston was dropped for him, however he looked more comfortable when he moved inside, where did he normally play at killie? Yet again im left looking at the team and saying changes have to be made, and yet again i'm left thinking theres little chance of that happening! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1NK S.J.F.C Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 The fans were appaling today, acted like fools, we did not back the team. The lads on the pitch are trying their best, unlike some of our fans who are still on the dole. So take notice of this eh, they are all working laddies, just like me and your faither. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
templeofsaints Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 Temple reports up now - FWIW I can only echo what's being said here. We only began to look like causing any trouble when McInnes went off. Stewart is a complete and utter waste of space. Jacko caused more trouble and created more chances in ten minutes than Stewart's done all bloody season. Defensively we looked better. I assume Stanic was dropped and the decision to play Ando at left-back was to nullify Harper. Even so it was a big gamble but Rusty and McManus were ok for the most part and Irvine seemed fine as long as he had some cover. But yet again the midfield was all over the place and because of that we again ended up with more pressure on the defence. Nobody seems able to hold onto the ball or move into space. Hardie was slow again and rash with some of his challenges (although Crawford etc's overacting didn't help). Quinn seemed ok on the right but drifted in as did Sheerin on the other flank. And all of that was IMHO to cover for McInnes a player who can't tackle, pass, mark or do anything his bloody experience should have as second nature for him - I swear the only sprint he did all afternoon was when he came out at the 2nd half. Quinn in the middle with Hardie behind him and Weatherston on the right suddenly opened up the game and created more movement than we'd done up until then. Sheerin improved towards the end but he has lost a yard or so of pace this season and why McCluskey who has hardly put a foot out of place all season was dropped even from the bench beats me. Deuchar did ok (no messiah-like miracles) but again lacked the service from midfield so he spends all his time going wide. He needs a reliable striker partner and I'd start Jacko or Peaso alongside him on Wednesday. And Stewart should be punted back to Westfield, at least Daal has contributed the odd pass or run on occasion. Owen has to see where the problems are - my worry though is he's signed these players to drop the current performers in the team (McCluskey, Weatherston, Peaso) rather than the off-form players. To be honest we don't deserve any better this season than what we've seen so far and if the manager can't change things round there will be calls for his head - something none of us wants to see after the good spirit and hope from last season. But Owen has to show he can manage the team now and not just rely on the momentum of a few wins. And if that means hard choices with his pals then so be it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scobby_SJFC Posted September 2, 2007 Report Share Posted September 2, 2007 The fans were appaling today, acted like fools, we did not back the team. The lads on the pitch are trying their best, unlike some of our fans who are still on the dole. So take notice of this eh, they are all working laddies, just like me and your faither. slightly harsh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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