Time for Levein to go

[Muirton Saint]

52 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

Just for a moment people need to look at what we have achieved in the last ten years and with a budget as small as ours that really is quite incredible.

As @RandomGuysays, spending can't be blamed, especially the last couple seasons.

 

53 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

Levein started at Cowdenbeath before having success at Hearts, Leicester, Dundee utd. He also managed Scotland before returning to Hearts. He must have had something to be given these appointments and you don't suddenly become a bad manager.

He had success early in his career sure, but not recently. How many times has the guy been sacked?

He also took a good four years away from management. That is plenty of time to become a bad manager.

57 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

I'm as concerened as every fan about how we are setting up, some obvious ommissions and how our gameplan is being implemented.

That's the thing, our gameplan is to not lose instead of to win. But even then we aren't capable of holding out for draws. We saw it vs St Mirren where we made a sub, changed the shape which confused the players and a goal was conceded.

 

59 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

But I'm not at training everyday and certainly don't know the players or how they are adapting to new coaches.

He's been in the job since November, that's plenty of training sessions for the players to adapt.

[blueheaven]

1 hour ago, Maskrey said:

He doesn’t trust the players in his squad which is evidenced by the constant wholesale changes from game to game. 

I think this is a huge part of the problem. He doesn't appear to rate his squad: we can sense that as fans, so you can bet the players will sense it. What will that be doing for the confidence levels in the dressing room? What will it be doing for the relationship between the players and the manager? He needs to be talking his players up, boosting their confidence and getting the best out of them, not chopping and changing every week and setting them up to defend at all costs because he doesn't have any belief in their abilities to do anything more than that.

[GMac]

Just seen a dreadful stat......In his 18 games in charge we have scored 5, yes FIVE goals from open play.    Simply not good enough.

[SaintJet]

3 minutes ago, blueheaven said:

I think this is a huge part of the problem. He doesn't appear to rate his squad: we can sense that as fans, so you can bet the players will sense it. What will that be doing for the confidence levels in the dressing room? What will it be doing for the relationship between the players and the manager? He needs to be talking his players up, boosting their confidence and getting the best out of them, not chopping and changing every week and setting them up to defend at all costs because he doesn't have any belief in their abilities to do anything more than that.

Good grief! You don't know any of that to be correct. Specualtion which isn't going to help.

Honestly BH, I enjoy reading your posts which are normally informative but you are becoming a bagman for Cagey - conspiracy and conjecture. 

[blueheaven]

50 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

Good grief! You don't know any of that to be correct. Specualtion which isn't going to help.

Honestly BH, I enjoy reading your posts which are normally informative but you are becoming a bagman for Cagey - conspiracy and conjecture. 

I've commented with my opinions and observations, which is all any of us can do and is the whole point of the forum. I'm not claiming any of it to be some sort of inside information and I've made it pretty clear that all I'm doing is giving my view. If you want to disagree with that view then go for it, but I don't see anything wrong in what I've posted.

 

[RandomGuy]

1 hour ago, SaintJet said:

Good grief! You don't know any of that to be correct. Specualtion which isn't going to help.

Honestly BH, I enjoy reading your posts which are normally informative but you are becoming a bagman for Cagey - conspiracy and conjecture. 

Its not really though is it?

Hes literally frozen Stevie May out, decided straight off Sprangler isnt up to starting, spoken openly about his CBs being too weak to play a back 4 as they need "protected as much as possible", and has sent at least 3 players to train with the youths to squeeze them out.

When things are going wrong on the pitch, the players will start second guessing these things.

[blueheaven]

3 minutes ago, RandomGuy said:

Its not really though is it?

Hes literally frozen Stevie May out, decided straight off Sprangler isnt up to starting, spoken openly about his CBs being too weak to play a back 4 as they need "protected as much as possible", and has sent at least 3 players to train with the youths to squeeze them out.

When things are going wrong on the pitch, the players will start second guessing these things.

Exactly. I mean, Drey Wright was openly questioning some of it on co-commentary during the St Mirren game. One example was him talking about how Stevie May should be starting up front with Clark because the two of them did so well together last season. 

 

[johndb]

Well here goes again - Training, Training, Training. If we lack speed then get them fit, see Ormond, Sturrock etc. 

Even as an 8 year old I was amazed by the way the team ran at full speed for 90 minutes. The odd time they were on TV it was notable but that was partly due to (lack of) camera angles. I read somewhere that perhaps the old teams were over trained. Or was it the sacked in the morning episode with Sturrock? 

 

[Gekko]

1 hour ago, blueheaven said:

Drey Wright was openly questioning some of it on co-commentary during the St Mirren game. One example was him talking about how Stevie May should be starting up front with Clark because the two of them did so well together last season. 

 

Listening to some of Drey's comments on Saturday was very telling.

I know he has a laid back style of speaking, but even taking that into account, He didn't exactly sound enthused about what was happening behind the scenes.

Plus the fact that he was so openly critical on such a public forum was surprising.

[SaintJet]

17 minutes ago, Gekko said:

Listening to some of Drey's comments on Saturday was very telling.

I know he has a laid back style of speaking, but even taking that into account, He didn't exactly sound enthused about what was happening behind the scenes.

Plus the fact that he was so openly critical on such a public forum was surprising.

I didn't read anything in to his comments at all and everyone is fitting this narrative to their point of view. I just thought he was lame as an analyst. Not Dre's fault he's just not cut out for commentry on this particular platform - I didn't think he said anything enlightening at all- pretty much like the commentator who is no John Motson.

[The Real Saints]

3 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

I didn't read anything in to his comments at all and everyone is fitting this narrative to their point of view. I just thought he was lame as an analyst. Not Dre's fault he's just not cut out for commentry on this particular platform - I didn't think he said anything enlightening at all- pretty much like the commentator who is no John Motson.

The teenage volunteer is no John Motson? That sounds very unsatisfactory. We must get rid immediately. 

[Ritspeed]

6 hours ago, blueheaven said:

I think this is a huge part of the problem. He doesn't appear to rate his squad: we can sense that as fans, so you can bet the players will sense it............

I think your assessment is spot on.  Dimitar Mitov's comments about lacking "fighting spirit" is revealing - most likely for the reasons you allude to.  I concede it must be difficult for the players to raise their spirits when they've been scrabbling around all season.  However strong, motivational leadership from management/coaches/player leaders should get over this lethargy.   I believe the squad is good enough. It's an old trope but I do believe Tommy Wright would have made much more fruitful use of the squad. 

[Aitchy]

I cant see a change being made this season. Levein was brought in to keep us in the league and at this moment in time we are evidently in a better position in the leagues than when he came in. Come this Saturday at 5pm we will have a better indication of where we are at. Really need to be looking for two much better performances than what we have seen since our return from the winter break. A win against Livi on Saturday is a must. 

I can see us finishing 11th. Cowie has come across well in his interviews and the likes of Dhanda, Murray, White and Brophy are all capable of scoring goals. I would have absolutely no confidence going into a play off game against the likes of Morton or Raith with this bunch of players. We would get bullied all over the place. 

As has been mentioned, given Levein a three year deal seems madness. After being burnt with Macca on a three year deal, surely the club should have learnt a lesson. 

[crieffsaintandy]

10 hours ago, SaintJet said:

Like everyone else on this board I am no expert when it comes to managing a Premier league side. I have an opinion and like a lot of people here I'm not happy with the football I'm having to watch week in week out. What Statistics will show, however, to anyone who is not blinkered is that changing managers continually is a recipe for disaster! Some people on this boad remind me of spoiled old firm fans who think they have a god given right to have a great football side and only have the good times.

Just for a moment people need to look at what we have achieved in the last ten years and with a budget as small as ours 

 

10 hours ago, SaintJet said:

 

You are correct constant change isn’t good, but your post is a bit like it’s all okay we were shit in the eighties which did the rounds a couple of years ago. I think it is basically people are scunnered by the boardroom decisions and malaise and the sub standard dross being served on the park in the last few years.

Yep the rot set in when Tommy left, Davidson did well with basically a Wright team and the biggest turning point was when we didn’t invest the cash in the team before the LASK game that game was the proverbial four pointer for the club and they royally f…..d it up not helped by the clown in the dugout.

i thought Levein wasn’t too bad appointment but he’s proving me wrong now, him and Kirk have lost it, yep we overachieved etc, but we didn’t spend the same dough when we were achieving as we have used lately, and what for a bloody mess and team full of a lot of players that aren’t good enough or lack any heart.

But why accept it when we know we can do better than where are just now.

[RandomGuy]

Theres an argument the rot set in after the first Scottish Cup win.

The club acted horrendously that Summer in terms of helping TW and without him as manager we'd have been far closer to relegation.

They took it for granted we'd just forever be bailed out and when it came to a struggle without TW, its fallen apart.

The accounts talk about setting up a proper scouting system to support the manager from now on, which hopefully reduces the risk of them struggling to find any players to sign and just going for stragglers.

[Aitchy]

The rot set in when Davidson and Brown started coming out with stuff about us “just being happy to be in the league” and “avoiding relegation would be a bigger achievement than winning two cups”.
 

An organisations mindset is set by those at the top. Coyle, McInnes, Lomas and Wright were always looking for us to be more ambitious and push us on to the next level.

 

[SaintJet]

18 hours ago, The Real Saints said:

The teenage volunteer is no John Motson? That sounds very unsatisfactory. We must get rid immediately. 

Maybe you could do it, you strike me as being full of it.

[R.B.B:- Adz]

Back into the play off spot we go

 

 

[R.B.B:- Adz]

1 hour ago, R.B.B:- Adz said:

Back into the play off spot we go

 

 

Phew!

[Kyle]

On 2/26/2024 at 8:27 PM, Aitchy said:

The rot set in when Davidson and Brown started coming out with stuff about us “just being happy to be in the league” and “avoiding relegation would be a bigger achievement than winning two cups”.
 

An organisations mindset is set by those at the top. Coyle, McInnes, Lomas and Wright were always looking for us to be more ambitious and push us on to the next level.

 

This for me is where pretty much all of our problems stem from and it's seeped into the players and the club. I think Maclean tried to shift that in his brief spell in charge (but wasn't a good manager) and Levein has given it steroids. 
 

I backed Levein's appointment as felt we needed a steadying hand and a fresh start. Being honest I feel like I'm watching Callum Davidson's team during the 10 game losing run all over again so whilst I think it was probably the right type of appointment in terms of experience, it's probably not the right individual. 

If the club don't want to see a massive drop in season ticket sales then I think they'll have to get rid of Levein. People are disgruntled enough with VAR, awful football since the double (and even the season we won the double we only scored 9 home goals) and other factors, I think the football on display currently and the prospect of another year of that will be the final straw for a lot of people. 

[blueheaven]

10 hours ago, Kyle said:

This for me is where pretty much all of our problems stem from and it's seeped into the players and the club. I think Maclean tried to shift that in his brief spell in charge (but wasn't a good manager) and Levein has given it steroids. 
 

100% this. What this club has needed ever since the Davidson reign went sour is a major confidence boost. Someone who can come in and excite the fans and lift the players and talk us up. I believe Macca understood that and really wanted to do that but just didn't know how, and he was the completely wrong appointment too. What Levein has done is shrink the whole club even further back into its shell. There's just no one who is of the mindset that the club should be kicking on a level and doing better, and trying to drive us forward like Coyle, McInnes, Lomas and Wright all did. Levein has two entire seasons left on his contract after this one. Even if we stay up, what are his ambitions for those two years? Just keeping us up with 0-0 draws every week from now until he retires? Is that seriously what success looks like?

[saintee in exile]

Hes strangling the last breaths of life out of the club.A totally uninspiring manager with zero passion

[sixties saintee]

Their talking about Warno k being on holiday, it's mare like our guy, not a ounce o passion in his body, demeanor,  or interviews, would rather hae got Yogi in.

.

[Cagey]

1 hour ago, saintee in exile said:

Hes strangling the last breaths of life out of the club.A totally uninspiring manager with zero passion

I am surprised then anyone was surprised with what we got with Levein.

Geoff cocked up big time.

[blueheaven]

3 hours ago, Cagey said:

I am surprised then anyone was surprised with what we got with Levein.

Geoff cocked up big time.

And let's not forget who our first choice was (shudder). It's not even as if we had someone brilliant lined up before we went for Levein. It all really makes me wonder what on earth has happened to our once-enviable manager selection process. Was there even a process this time?