What now

[R.B.B:- Adz]

2 hours ago, Cagey said:

I think what happened was he had a discussion with the squad that got humped then sent out for the senior players that were not involved for the group to have their say. Hopefully they got to the bottom of the problem but things like that can cause division.

 

2 hours ago, john.w said:

exactly what may said Cagey

That’s my point though, what does he think a meeting of his senior heads is going to achieve when many of them ARE the problem 

[Aitchy]

Davidson, Grieve, Flaherty have all massively contributed towards where we are, but ultimately the decisions to hire all three and keep them at the club as long as they did lies with Steve Brown. History will look kindly upon the great success we had during his tenure, but the last two years of his legacy were a disaster.

Moving forwards, I can see no merit in continuously trying to blame certain individuals for the position we are in. We as a support need to get behind the club as much as we can. I realise that’s extremely difficult, particularly when we have just just witnessed one of our worst ever results and we are a few days away from beginning a league campaign with an extremely poor looking squad, but what’s the alternative?

Im not suggesting people don’t critique line ups or formations, but getting on players backs at the games and directing drivel at players on social media serves no purpose. When the club decided that Macca was the man they wanted to lead the club, they had no option but to give him a long term contract. It’s been hard enough to sign players and would have been made even harder if we had only given him a one year deal. Players like Mitov and Jephcott would be very unlikely to have moved hundreds of miles to join us if they manager that wanted to sign them was only contracted for a year.

It’s not going to be easy, but when we get another two or three permanent players through the door and supplement them with some loans later in the window we will be in a much better place. Added to that, if and it’s a big if, we can get Kane, Clark and MacPherson fit and playing regularly, then that will make a big difference as well.

 

[slf]

1 hour ago, Aitchy said:

Davidson, Grieve, Flaherty have all massively contributed towards where we are, but ultimately the decisions to hire all three and keep them at the club as long as they did lies with Steve Brown. History will look kindly upon the great success we had during his tenure, but the last two years of his legacy were a disaster.

Moving forwards, I can see no merit in continuously trying to blame certain individuals for the position we are in. We as a support need to get behind the club as much as we can. I realise that’s extremely difficult, particularly when we have just just witnessed one of our worst ever results and we are a few days away from beginning a league campaign with an extremely poor looking squad, but what’s the alternative?

Im not suggesting people don’t critique line ups or formations, but getting on players backs at the games and directing drivel at players on social media serves no purpose. When the club decided that Macca was the man they wanted to lead the club, they had no option but to give him a long term contract. It’s been hard enough to sign players and would have been made even harder if we had only given him a one year deal. Players like Mitov and Jephcott would be very unlikely to have moved hundreds of miles to join us if they manager that wanted to sign them was only contracted for a year.

It’s not going to be easy, but when we get another two or three permanent players through the door and supplement them with some loans later in the window we will be in a much better place. Added to that, if and it’s a big if, we can get Kane, Clark and MacPherson fit and playing regularly, then that will make a big difference as well.

 

I agree ,hope yer right 

[Widge]

10 hours ago, Aitchy said:

Davidson, Grieve, Flaherty have all massively contributed towards where we are, but ultimately the decisions to hire all three and keep them at the club as long as they did lies with Steve Brown. History will look kindly upon the great success we had during his tenure, but the last two years of his legacy were a disaster.

Moving forwards, I can see no merit in continuously trying to blame certain individuals for the position we are in. We as a support need to get behind the club as much as we can. I realise that’s extremely difficult, particularly when we have just just witnessed one of our worst ever results and we are a few days away from beginning a league campaign with an extremely poor looking squad, but what’s the alternative?

Im not suggesting people don’t critique line ups or formations, but getting on players backs at the games and directing drivel at players on social media serves no purpose. When the club decided that Macca was the man they wanted to lead the club, they had no option but to give him a long term contract. It’s been hard enough to sign players and would have been made even harder if we had only given him a one year deal. Players like Mitov and Jephcott would be very unlikely to have moved hundreds of miles to join us if they manager that wanted to sign them was only contracted for a year.

It’s not going to be easy, but when we get another two or three permanent players through the door and supplement them with some loans later in the window we will be in a much better place. Added to that, if and it’s a big if, we can get Kane, Clark and MacPherson fit and playing regularly, then that will make a big difference as well.

 

I think this is spot on. I think every man and their dog who has a connection with Saints knows the last 2/3 years have been a disaster on and off the pitch for a variety of reasons and it's left us in a really poor position on the pitch to say the least. The running of the club does appear to be improving, based on the outputs, media, etc. as well as the feedback from the open meetings. What we need to collectively do is essentially move past the Davidson/Flaherty era and try and push the team on the pitch on as far as we can (with the caveat that there is still lingering players who will be around for a while.

I'm not yet convinced by MacLean's managerial ability or tactical nous yet, far from it. What I can get behind is his transfer strategy (even if has been forced upon him), as well as his willingness to use younger players (again forced and maybe their not good enough). 

One thing that saints fans do and did even throughout Davidson's worst spells was back the team and show support. It's difficult for sure when you see what's going on, on the pitch, but ultimately the only way we get out this slump and mess that we've created is to try and be positive as a fanbase, as a club and hopefully that transfers onto the pitch in the form of some fight and spirit, as there seems to be a massive negative cloud over the whole stadium right now. That cloud is probably entirely fair as well, it's been self inflicted, but come Saturday, first game of the league season you're going to have 3500 Hearts fans making a lot of noise, it won't do the Saints team any good to get a tepid and lukewarm reception, despite it being warranted.

It's frustrating that the fans once again need to get the players going and get a reaction, when it's about time they do the opposite. Quite frankly there are a large number in our squad who owe the fans big time. 

[SaintJet]

15 hours ago, blueheaven said:

I really don't see any point in talking about changing the manager again at this stage. Any replacement manager is going to have exactly the same issues to overcome. They're going to have the same restrictive budget in the transfer market and the same Davidson duds to work with. The club can't just give Macca a three year contract, barely back him at all, and then sack him after a pre-season because things aren't suddenly all sunshine and roses. They decided Macca was the man for the job so they need to get behind him and support him so that he can do his job as well as possible for the foreseeable future. And at this point I really have to question whether they're doing that.

So your telling that if we start the league season with four straight defeats we are going to close ranks and just carry on regardless? 

I'm hoping that Steve McLean can turn this ship around but you can't see any evidence of improvement throughout the league cup stages. The board chose the cheap option in a young manager with no real experience who was CD's right hand man; I hate to say it but this could summon the end of our premier league status.

[St. Paddy]

40 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

So your telling that if we start the league season with four straight defeats we are going to close ranks and just carry on regardless? 

 

Well, yes....

Not sure who it will benefit to berate and condemn a situation we could all see unfold over the last 2 or 3 years.

 

It's pretty clear we currently don't have a squad or even a starting 11 capable of challenging for survival AT THE MOMMENT.

Are we looking like correcting this? Maybe... certainly moving in the right direction. 

Is macca the man to lead us to safety? Maybe, and I'm basing that on the last 6 games of last season where he took a bloated squad, devoid of belief, and galvanised them.  

Hearts should beat us.

Ross might beat us.

Celtic will beat us.

Losing those three with the current squad would be no surprise.

I'm waiting to see the full squad, a much stronger starting 11,and a clear indication that we are moving in the right direction (or not)

That will take more than the next 4 weeks, unfortunately.

 

 

[rik2304]

Jordan White will rip our CBs apart at the moment.

[St. Paddy]

7 minutes ago, rik2304 said:

Jordan White will rip our CBs apart at the moment.

Betty White would rip our CBs apart at the moment

[slf]

Just now, slf said:

56 minutes ago, St. Paddy said:

Betty White 

I remember Betty 

[SaintJet]

3 hours ago, St. Paddy said:

Well, yes....

Not sure who it will benefit to berate and condemn a situation we could all see unfold over the last 2 or 3 years.

 

It's pretty clear we currently don't have a squad or even a starting 11 capable of challenging for survival AT THE MOMMENT.

Are we looking like correcting this? Maybe... certainly moving in the right direction. 

Is macca the man to lead us to safety? Maybe, and I'm basing that on the last 6 games of last season where he took a bloated squad, devoid of belief, and galvanised them.  

Hearts should beat us.

Ross might beat us.

Celtic will beat us.

Losing those three with the current squad would be no surprise.

I'm waiting to see the full squad, a much stronger starting 11,and a clear indication that we are moving in the right direction (or not)

That will take more than the next 4 weeks, unfortunately.

 

 

I haven't seen any evidence of anyone being galvanised in the pre season or league cup.

I'm sorry but we needed a new personality to shake up and provide a new identity for a team who have proven their worthy of staying in the premier league.

I'm not castigating Macca I just though he was the wrong choice and has been thrown in the deep end.

We start - Hearts, Ross, Celtic, Dundee, Rangers, Hibs

Can anyone see us getting anything out of that slate of games the way we are playing? 

I'd love to be wrong.

[Maskrey]

34 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

I haven't seen any evidence of anyone being galvanised in the pre season or league cup.

I'm sorry but we needed a new personality to shake up and provide a new identity for a team who have proven their worthy of staying in the premier league.

I'm not castigating Macca I just though he was the wrong choice and has been thrown in the deep end.

We start - Hearts, Ross, Celtic, Dundee, Rangers, Hibs

Can anyone see us getting anything out of that slate of games the way we are playing? 

I'd love to be wrong.

McLean is not the problem.  He simply has not been backed by signings.  We can’t bring in a manager on a long contract, don’t back him then fire him before the season has even started.  At the end of the day our main priorities is to stay in the league and anything else is a bonus.  That is the reality.  The senior pros seem to be getting some criticism but guys like McGowan would run through a brick wall for the team and you need these kind of players in a squad and by all accounts he is a great character within the club.  I would be more concerned about the players who we are looking to produce the assists and goals.  Can we really say we can rely on May for this?  I don’t think he is good enough at this level anymore.

[R.B.B:- Adz]

14 minutes ago, Maskrey said:

McLean is not the problem.  He simply has not been backed by signings.  We can’t bring in a manager on a long contract, don’t back him then fire him before the season has even started.  At the end of the day our main priorities is to stay in the league and anything else is a bonus.  That is the reality.  The senior pros seem to be getting some criticism but guys like McGowan would run through a brick wall for the team and you need these kind of players in a squad and by all accounts he is a great character within the club.  I would be more concerned about the players who we are looking to produce the assists and goals.  Can we really say we can rely on May for this?  I don’t think he is good enough at this level anymore.

Can you give me an example of your McGowan statement? 

[blueheaven]

5 hours ago, SaintJet said:

So your telling that if we start the league season with four straight defeats we are going to close ranks and just carry on regardless? 

Carrying on regardless is the last thing I want, or have wanted for a long time. The club has got a lot of things wrong over the last couple of years, and in my view they're still getting things wrong, despite the changes at the top. But the question I'd ask is, is that Steven MacLean's fault? Replace him after four games if you like, but is that actually going to remove the causes of our problems? To me, all he'd be is a scapegoat.

[SaintJet]

53 minutes ago, blueheaven said:

Carrying on regardless is the last thing I want, or have wanted for a long time. The club has got a lot of things wrong over the last couple of years, and in my view they're still getting things wrong, despite the changes at the top. But the question I'd ask is, is that Steven MacLean's fault? Replace him after four games if you like, but is that actually going to remove the causes of our problems? To me, all he'd be is a scapegoat.

I don't think Steve McLean would be regarded as a scapegoat; he was a cheap option and he might still work out and I hope he does.

I go back to another point I made and that was that we needed a new voice and a new identity. If we continue the form we are in just now sadly McLean won't be able to continue and a doing from the Jambos on Saturday will ramp up the pressure.

I'm praying the team has a good look at itself and springs a surprise but it's hard to see that with what I witnessed on Saturday.

[blueheaven]

21 minutes ago, SaintJet said:

I don't think Steve McLean would be regarded as a scapegoat; he was a cheap option and he might still work out and I hope he does.

I go back to another point I made and that was that we needed a new voice and a new identity. If we continue the form we are in just now sadly McLean won't be able to continue and a doing from the Jambos on Saturday will ramp up the pressure.

I'm praying the team has a good look at itself and springs a surprise but it's hard to see that with what I witnessed on Saturday.

If he was to be sacked four league games into the season, I'd consider that to be a scapegoating. Rebuilding the mess left behind by Davidson was always going to be a huge job and I just don't think it would be fair to hand that task to an inexperienced manager and then decide almost instantly to take it away from him again.

I don't necessarily believe the club made the right decision in appointing Macca. But he's in the job now so I do believe the club has a duty to get behind him, support him with a decent budget and provide him with the best possible chance of making a success of it. I just don't think they're doing that at the moment.

 

 

[RandomGuy]

MacLean has a nearly impossible job.

- Cut squad size from ~40 to ~25

- 25 man squad must contain multiple players who've never played above the 3rd tier

- Average age of squad must be cut

- Wage spend must be drastically cut

- Squad must be improved

- Avoid relegation

Those were his tasks after last season ended.

Id rather a fresh face/voice had come in but the clubs committed itself to MacLean and hes doing as well as he can recruitment wise, IMO. Fixing us was never a one season job, never mind one window, so happy enough to deal with a shit season and possible relegation if the signs are there that the ships facing the right direction again. Any long term success for us likely needs us to be able to cope with a relegation and bounce back quickly.

[Maskrey]

5 hours ago, R.B.B:- Adz said:

Can you give me an example of your McGowan statement? 

What kind of example do you want?  His work rate and commitment are a real example to everyone around him.  I don’t get the criticisms towards him at all, we are lucky to have him.

[Setting Son]

8 hours ago, rik2304 said:

Jordan White will rip our CBs apart at the moment.

TalkSPORT 

[Broggy Man]

We can blame anybody we want but the blame lies with our old chairman spending money and thinking watching the crap served up was showing a good investment

[R.B.B:- Adz]

Macca/Liam have got their man as Liam Thomson will be announced as the new first team performance analyst.

A really important role at any football club these days.

Now he needs some decent signings to analyse.

[templeofsaints]

42 minutes ago, R.B.B:- Adz said:

Macca/Liam have got their man as Liam Thomson will be announced as the new first team performance analyst.

A really important role at any football club these days.

Now he needs some decent signings to analyse.

According to the Courier he's the one that identified and let Macca know about Sam McLelland

[Havana Saint]

On 7/31/2023 at 12:52 PM, Cagey said:

Crisis meeting. Panicking?

I'm sick every day at the moment.

[sixties saintee]

8 hours ago, templeofsaints said:

According to the Courier he's the one that identified and let Macca know about Sam McLelland

Along wae Tommy

[SaintJet]

https://twitter.com/BBCSportScot?ref_src=twsrc^google|twcamp^serp|twgr^author

 

[R.B.B:- Adz]

11 hours ago, templeofsaints said:

According to the Courier he's the one that identified and let Macca know about Sam McLelland

 

2 hours ago, sixties saintee said:

Along wae Tommy

https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/23697573.maclean-reveals-wright-assist-mcclelland-st-johnstone-transfer/